Northern Unit Refurbishments

[Neptune]

Regarding the 323s, did Hunslet who built them went into liquidation soon after the last one was built, and before when privatisation happened back in 1994?

Yes pretty much. Lack of orders did for them sadly. I remember seeing various brand new 323’s outside when passing on the train.

Also the spare body was sent to Crossley’s scrapyard in Shipley eventually and lasted there quite a while.

 

[py_megapixel]

You can (and we do, on the last service at Christmas) run 6 car 323s on the Manchester - Stoke line. They fit everywhere in the up direction to Stoke. Although that service runs empty stock back, so not sure if the platforms are long enough in the down direction (I don’t sign that route)

From what I've been told it's not possible for the guard to safely dispatch a 6-car from the down platform at Cheadle Hulme due to the curvature of the platform being so much that part of the train would be out of sight. I could well believe that - I've seen them dispatch 3-cars from there and even that seems a bit of a stretch, with the guard having to practically stand against the fence at the back of the platform and look around to be able to see the whole thing

 

[Neptune]

From what I've been told it's not possible for the guard to safely dispatch a 6-car from the down platform at Cheadle Hulme due to the curvature of the platform being so much that part of the train would be out of sight. I could well believe that - I've seen them dispatch 3-cars from there and even that seems a bit of a stretch, with the guard having to practically stand against the fence at the back of the platform and look around to be able to see the whole thing

The solution to that could be to train booking office staff as dispatchers (if they aren’t already). That is one of the plans for Shipley once 6 car working comes in (the conductor needs to be in the middle on platform 2, 3 & 5 but that won’t be possible with a 6 car set as they would be at the forward most door on the 4th coach in the formation). Booking office staff at Shipley are already dispatch trained for LNER services.

Platform 1 at Shipley is also bad for sighting at the rear door of a 333 but on a 331 when you are at the 2nd door from the rear you can see the whole train but I believe the plan for platform 1 is still for dispatch staff.

 

[MP393]

From what I've been told it's not possible for the guard to safely dispatch a 6-car from the down platform at Cheadle Hulme due to the curvature of the platform being so much that part of the train would be out of sight. I could well believe that - I've seen them dispatch 3-cars from there and even that seems a bit of a stretch, with the guard having to practically stand against the fence at the back of the platform and look around to be able to see the whole thing

There is one booked 6 car 331 through there every morning on the 0629 Stoke Blackpool.., and yeah now you mention it I bet that is a real pain!

 

[Ryry]

From pictures on flickr and videos on YouTube there seems to be alot of class 150s coming into Heaton depot. Believe today's move showed 150006

 

[978wta]

From pictures on flickr and videos on YouTube there seems to be alot of class 150s coming into Heaton depot. Believe today's move showed 150006

They are there for WSP mods I believe.

 

[Liam L]

Hello - Any ideas which unit is going down this morning?

Realtime Trains - 594I 1010 Allerton Depot to Wolverton Centre Sidings

Realtime Trains is an independent source of live realtime running information for the Great British railway network.

www.realtimetrains.co.uk

 

[Adam0984]

Hello - Any ideas which unit is going down this morning?

Realtime Trains - 594I 1010 Allerton Depot to Wolverton Centre Sidings

Realtime Trains is an independent source of live realtime running information for the Great British railway network.

www.realtimetrains.co.uk

323224

 

[Liam L]

323224

Thanks

 

[3973EXL]

323230

Realtime Trains - 500J 1435 Wolverton Centre Sidings to Allerton Depot

 

[simon7929]

Unit 156479 has now had the digital/wi-fi mods.

 

[py_megapixel]

If they carry on doing them this slowly then I'd expect some of them to be scrapped before they get the digital train mods...

 

[simon7929]

The Heaton based 156s are being done at a very slow rate. The NH ones were done at the same time they were refurbished.

Out of the 31 based at Heaton. Around 6 have the mods.

 

[diligentdave]

The Heaton based 156s are being done at a very slow rate. The NH ones were done at the same time they were refurbished.

Out of the 31 based at Heaton. Around 6 have the mods.

Actually, no, the NH (or Porterbrook fleet as they are) weren't done during refurbishment. The digital train stuff was all done after they had been through works.

 

[158757]

Updated list 04/08/21 with units now with Digital Train Mods

Liveries

Northern livery with logos

# – Digital Train Modifications complete (USB, CCTV, additional PIS screens)
# - Northern Connect Mods (Seat reservations)
Prototype refurbishment – light blue seat backs, Arriva turquoise grab poles, cream coloured end walls

150001 - Refurbished, new blue moquette Ashbourne seats
150002 - Refurbished, new blue moquette Ashbourne seats

150003: 150116 / 57209 Refurbished, new blue moquette Ashbourne seats
150004: 150112 / 57212 Refurbished, new blue moquette Ashbourne seats
150005: 150117 / 52223 Refurbished, new blue moquette Ashbourne seats (Chapman seats in centre vehicle)
150006: 150147 / 57223 Refurbished, new blue moquette Chapman seats

# 150101 - Refurbished, new blue moquette Ashbourne seats
150102 - Refurbished, new blue moquette Ashbourne seats
150103 - Refurbished, new blue moquette Ashbourne seats
150104 - Refurbished, new blue moquette Ashbourne seats
150105 - Refurbished, new blue moquette Ashbourne seats
150106 - Refurbished, new blue moquette Ashbourne seats
150107 - Refurbished, new blue moquette Ashbourne seats
150108 - Refurbished, new blue moquette Ashbourne seats
150109 - Refurbished, new blue moquette Ashbourne seats
# 150110 - Refurbished, new blue moquette Ashbourne seats
150111 - Refurbished, new blue moquette Ashbourne seats
# 150113 - Refurbished, new blue moquette Ashbourne seats
150114 - Refurbished, new blue moquette Ashbourne seats
150115 - Refurbished, new blue moquette Ashbourne seats
150118 - Refurbished, new blue moquette Ashbourne seats
150119 - Refurbished, new blue moquette Ashbourne seats
150120 - Refurbished, new blue moquette Ashbourne seats
150121 - Refurbished, new blue moquette Ashbourne seats
150122 - Refurbished, new blue moquette Ashbourne seats
150123 - Refurbished, new blue moquette Ashbourne seats
150124 - Refurbished, new blue moquette Ashbourne seats
# 150125 - Refurbished, new blue moquette Ashbourne seats
# 150126 - Refurbished, new blue moquette Ashbourne seats
150127 - Refurbished, new blue moquette Ashbourne seats
150128 - Refurbished, new blue moquette Ashbourne seats
150129 - Refurbished, new blue moquette Ashbourne seats
# 150130 - Refurbished, new blue moquette Ashbourne seats
150131 - Refurbished, new blue moquette Ashbourne seats
150132 - Refurbished, new blue moquette Ashbourne seats
150133 - Refurbished, new blue moquette Chapman seats
150134 - Refurbished, new blue moquette Chapman seats
150135 - Refurbished, new blue moquette Chapman seats
150136 - Refurbished, new blue moquette Chapman seats
150137 - Refurbished, new blue moquette Chapman seats
150138 - Refurbished, new blue moquette Chapman seats
150139 - Refurbished, new blue moquette Chapman seats
150140 - Refurbished, new blue moquette Chapman seats
150141 - Refurbished, new blue moquette Chapman seats
150142 - Refurbished, new blue moquette Chapman seats
150143 - Refurbished, new blue moquette Chapman seats
150144 - Refurbished, new blue moquette Chapman seats
150145 - Refurbished, new blue moquette Chapman seats
150146 - Refurbished, new blue moquette Chapman seats
150148 - Refurbished, new blue moquette Chapman seats
150149 - Refurbished, new blue moquette Chapman seats
150150 - Refurbished, new blue moquette Chapman seats

150120, 123, 127, 128, 129, 130, 131 retain Silverlink NSE blue wall carpet
150136 has several rows of seats in airline layout

150201 - Refurbished, new blue moquette Chapman seats
150203 - Refurbished, new blue moquette Chapman seats
150204 - Refurbished, new blue moquette Ashbourne seats
150205 - Refurbished, new blue moquette Chapman seats
150206 - Refurbished, new blue moquette Ashbourne seats
150210 - Refurbished, new blue moquette Ashbourne seats
150211 - Refurbished, new blue moquette Chapman seats
150214 - Refurbished, new blue moquette Ashbourne seats
150215 - Refurbished, new blue moquette Chapman seats
150218 - Refurbished, new blue moquette Chapman seats
# 150220 - Refurbished, new blue moquette Ashbourne seats
150222 - Refurbished, new blue moquette Chapman seats
150224 - Refurbished, new blue moquette Chapman seats
150225 - Refurbished, new blue moquette Chapman seats
150226 - Refurbished, new blue moquette Ashbourne seats
# 150228 - Refurbished, new blue moquette Ashbourne seats
# 150268 - Refurbished, new blue moquette Ashbourne seats
# 150269 - Refurbished, new blue moquette Ashbourne seats
# 150270 - Refurbished, new blue moquette Ashbourne seats
# 150271 - Refurbished, new blue moquette Ashbourne seats
# 150272 - Refurbished, new blue moquette Ashbourne seats
# 150273 - Refurbished, new blue moquette Ashbourne seats
# 150274 - Refurbished, new blue moquette Ashbourne seats
# 150275 – Refurbished (prototype style), new blue moquette Ashbourne seats
# 150276 - Refurbished, new blue moquette Ashbourne seats
# 150277 - Refurbished, new blue moquette Ashbourne seats

150205 has a row of seats that were incorrectly fitted in a bay layout on refurb

155341 - Refurbished, new blue moquette Chapman seats
155342 - Refurbished, new blue moquette Chapman seats
155343 - Refurbished, new blue moquette Chapman seats
155344 - Refurbished, new blue moquette Chapman seats
155345 - Refurbished, new blue moquette Chapman seats
155346 - Refurbished (prototype style), new blue moquette Chapman seats
155347 - Refurbished, new blue moquette Chapman seats

# 156420 - Refurbished, new blue moquette Chapman seats
# 156421 - Refurbished, new blue moquette Chapman seats
# 156423 - Refurbished, new blue moquette Chapman seats
# 156424 - Refurbished, new blue moquette Chapman seats
# 156425 - Refurbished, new blue moquette Chapman seats
# 156426 - Refurbished, new blue moquette Chapman seats
# 156427 - Refurbished, new blue moquette Chapman seats
# 156428 - Refurbished, new blue moquette Chapman seats
# 156429 - Refurbished, new blue moquette Chapman seats
156438 - Refurbished, new blue moquette Richmond seats
# 156440 - Refurbished, new blue moquette Chapman seats
# 156441 - Refurbished, new blue moquette Chapman seats
156443 - Refurbished, new blue moquette Richmond seats
156444 - Refurbished, new blue moquette Richmond seats
156447 - Refurbished, new blue flat cloth Fainsa seats
156448 - Refurbished, new blue moquette Richmond seats
156449 - Refurbished, new blue flat cloth Fainsa seats
# 156451 - Refurbished, new blue moquette Richmond seats
# 156452 - Refurbished, new blue moquette Chapman seats
156454 - Refurbished, new blue moquette Richmond seats
# 156455 - Refurbished, new blue moquette Chapman seats
# 156459 - Refurbished, new blue moquette Chapman seats
# 156460 - Refurbished, new blue moquette Chapman seats
# 156461 - Refurbished, new blue moquette Chapman seats
156463 - Refurbished, new blue moquette Richmond seats
# 156464 - Refurbished, new blue moquette Chapman seats
156465 - Refurbished, new blue flat cloth Fainsa seats
# 156466 - Refurbished, new blue moquette Chapman seats
156468 - Refurbished, new blue moquette Richmond seats
156469 - Refurbished, new blue moquette Richmond seats
156471 - Refurbished, new blue moquette Richmond seats
156472 - Refurbished, new blue moquette Richmond seats
156475 - Refurbished, new blue moquette Richmond seats
# 156479 - Refurbished, new blue moquette Richmond seats
156480 - Refurbished, new blue moquette Richmond seats (RAF 100 vinyls)
156481 - Refurbished, new blue moquette Richmond seats
# 156482 - Refurbished, new blue moquette Richmond seats
156483 - Refurbished, new blue moquette Richmond seats
156484 - Refurbished, new blue moquette Richmond seats
156485 - Refurbished, new blue flat cloth Fainsa seats
156486 - Refurbished, new blue moquette Richmond seats
# 156487 - Refurbished, new blue moquette Richmond seats
# 156488 - Refurbished, new blue moquette Richmond seats
156489 - Refurbished, new blue moquette Richmond seats
156490 - Refurbished, new blue moquette Richmond seats
156491 - Refurbished, new blue moquette Richmond seats
156496 - Refurbished, new blue flat cloth Fainsa seats

# 158752 - Refurbished, new blue moquette MTB seats
# 158753 - Refurbished, new blue moquette MTB seats
# 158754 - Refurbished, new blue moquette MTB seats
# 158755 - Refurbished, new blue moquette MTB seats
# 158756 - Refurbished, new blue moquette MTB seats
# 158757 - Refurbished, new blue moquette MTB seats
# 158758 - Refurbished, new blue moquette MTB seats
# 158759 - Refurbished, new blue moquette MTB seats

158782 - Refurbished, new blue flat cloth Fainsa seats
158784 - Refurbished, new blue flat cloth Fainsa seats
158786 - Refurbished, new blue flat cloth Fainsa seats
158787 - Refurbished, new blue flat cloth Fainsa seats
158789 - Refurbished, new blue flat cloth Fainsa seats
# 158790 - Refurbished, new blue flat cloth Fainsa seats
# 158791 - Refurbished, new blue flat cloth Fainsa seats
158792 - Refurbished, new blue flat cloth Fainsa seats
158793 - Refurbished, new blue flat cloth Fainsa seats
# 158794 - Refurbished, new blue flat cloth Fainsa seats
# 158795 - Refurbished, new blue flat cloth Fainsa seats
158796 - Refurbished, new blue flat cloth Fainsa seats
158797 - Refurbished, new blue flat cloth Fainsa seats
158815 - Refurbished, new blue flat cloth Fainsa seats
158816 - Refurbished, new blue flat cloth Fainsa seats
158817 - Refurbished, new blue flat cloth Fainsa seats
158842 - Refurbished, new blue flat cloth Fainsa seats
158843 - Refurbished, new blue flat cloth Fainsa seats
158844 - Refurbished, new blue flat cloth Fainsa seats
## 158845 - Refurbished, new blue flat cloth Fainsa seats
158848 - Refurbished, new blue flat cloth Fainsa seats
## 158849 - Refurbished, new blue flat cloth Fainsa seats
158850 - Refurbished, new blue flat cloth Fainsa seats
158851 - Refurbished, new blue flat cloth Fainsa seats
158853 - Refurbished, new blue flat cloth Fainsa seats
158855 - Refurbished, new blue flat cloth Fainsa seats
158859 - Refurbished, new blue flat cloth Fainsa seats
158860 - Refurbished, new blue flat cloth Fainsa seats (Thank you NHS vinyls)
158861 - Refurbished, new blue flat cloth Fainsa seats
158867 - Refurbished, new blue flat cloth Fainsa seats
158868 - Refurbished, new blue flat cloth Fainsa seats
158869 - Refurbished, new blue flat cloth Fainsa seats
158870 - Refurbished, new blue flat cloth Fainsa seats
158871 - Refurbished, new blue flat cloth Fainsa seats
158872 - Refurbished, new blue flat cloth Fainsa seats

# 158901 - Refurbished, new blue flat cloth Fainsa seats
# 158902 - Refurbished, new blue flat cloth Fainsa seats
# 158903 - Refurbished, new blue flat cloth Fainsa seats
# 158904 - Refurbished, new blue flat cloth Fainsa seats
# 158905 - Refurbished, new blue flat cloth Fainsa seats
# 158906 - Refurbished, new blue flat cloth Fainsa seats
# 158907 - Refurbished, new blue flat cloth Fainsa seats
# 158908 - Refurbished, new blue flat cloth Fainsa seats
# 158909 - Refurbished, new blue flat cloth Fainsa seats
# 158910 - Refurbished, new blue flat cloth Fainsa seats

158752 and 158756 have cream coloured end walls instead of navy blue

158752-759, 782, 786, 789, 867-871 retain the parcels cupboard in the 57 end vehicle

# 170453 - Refurbished, new blue moquette Chapman seats
# 170454 - Refurbished, new blue moquette Chapman seats
# 170455 - Refurbished, new blue moquette Chapman seats
# 170456 - Refurbished, new blue moquette Chapman seats
# 170457 - Refurbished, new blue moquette Chapman seats
# 170458 - Refurbished, new blue moquette Chapman seats
# 170459 - Refurbished, new blue moquette Chapman seats
# 170460 - Refurbished, new blue moquette Chapman seats
# 170461 - Refurbished, new blue moquette Chapman seats
# 170472 - Refurbished, new blue moquette Chapman seats
# 170473 - Refurbished, new blue moquette Chapman seats
# 170474 - Refurbished, new blue moquette Chapman seats
# 170475 - Refurbished, new blue moquette Chapman seats
# 170476 - Refurbished, new blue moquette Chapman seats
# 170477 - Refurbished, new blue moquette Chapman seats
# 170478 - Refurbished, new blue moquette Chapman seats

170453-458 retain an old first class section (declassified) at each end of the train

Key

Liveries

Northern livery with logos
Unbranded Thameslink White/Blue

319361 – refurbished, new blue flat cloth seats
319366 – refurbished, new blue flat cloth seats
319367 – refurbished, new blue flat cloth seats
319368 – refurbished, new blue flat cloth seats
319369 – refurbished, dark purple “Northern Electrics” moquette seats
319370 – refurbished, First Capital Connect moquette seats
319372 – unrefurbished, FCC moquette seats and interior
319375 – refurbished, new blue flat cloth seats
319378 – refurbished, dark purple “Northern Electrics” moquette seats
319379 – refurbished, new blue flat cloth seats
319381 – refurbished, First Capital Connect moquette seats
319383 – refurbished, new blue flat cloth seats
319384 – refurbished, First Capital Connect moquette seats
319385 – refurbished, First Capital Connect moquette seats
319386 – refurbished, dark purple “Northern Electrics” moquette seats

769424 – refurbished, new blue moquette seats
769431 – refurbished, new blue moquette seats
769434 – refurbished, new blue moquette seats
769442 – refurbished, new blue moquette seats
769448 – refurbished, new blue moquette seats
769450 – refurbished, new blue moquette seats
769456 – refurbished, new blue moquette seats
769458 – refurbished, new blue moquette seats

319367 has additional PIS screens fitted although never used
All Northern 769s retain a declassified first class section

323223 – refurbished, new blue moquette seats
323224 – refurbished, new blue moquette seats
323225 – refurbished, new blue moquette seats
323226 – refurbished, new blue moquette seats
323227 – refurbished, new blue moquette seats
323228 – refurbished, new blue moquette seats
323229 – refurbished, new blue moquette seats
323230 – refurbished, new blue moquette seats
323231 – refurbished, new blue moquette seats
323232 – refurbished, new blue moquette seats
323233 – refurbished, new blue moquette seats
323234 – refurbished, new blue moquette seats
323235 – refurbished, new blue moquette seats
323236 – refurbished, new blue moquette seats
323237 – refurbished, new blue moquette seats
323238 – refurbished, new blue moquette seats
323239 – refurbished, new blue moquette seats

333001 – refurbished, new blue moquette seats
333002 – refurbished, new blue moquette seats
333003 – refurbished, new blue moquette seats
333004 – refurbished, new blue moquette seats
333005 – refurbished, new blue moquette seats
333006 – refurbished, new blue moquette seats
333007 – refurbished, new blue moquette seats
333008 – refurbished, new blue moquette seats
333009 – refurbished, new blue moquette seats
333010 – refurbished, new blue moquette seats
333011 – refurbished, new blue moquette seats
333012 – refurbished, new blue moquette seats
333013 – refurbished, new blue moquette seats
333014 – refurbished, new blue moquette seats
333015 – refurbished, new blue moquette seats
333016 – refurbished, new blue moquette seats

Edited to include 158791 and 158794 as per @northernchris below.

 

[northernchris]

@158757 thanks for the update. Both 158791 and 158794 have received the digi mods

 

[JakeMurphy]

150139 and 102 now have digital mods except the fact 139 doesn’t yet have information screens

 

[simon7929]

Unit 156491 now has digital mods.

 

[Liam L]

Good Afternoon, just having a look RTT to see if there any Northern 323s heading to/from Wolverton and noticed that the return path yesterday was cancelled. Just wondering when it will be possibly returning?

Realtime Trains - 582Q 1303 Wolverton Centre Sidings to Allerton Depot

Realtime Trains is an independent source of live realtime running information for the Great British railway network.

www.realtimetrains.co.uk

thanks.

 

[JakeMurphy]

323238 did 5Q70 yesterday morning to Wolverton

 

[jonesy3001]

This is interesting 6 car 323 workings and 150s gone in a couple of years, wonder if they're getting all 26 from WMT then.

https://democracy.transportforthenorth.com/documents/s2801/Appendix%20D%20MRTF%20RoadMap.pdf

 

[Wolfie]

This is interesting 6 car 323 workings and 150s gone in a couple of years, wonder if they're getting all 26 from WMT then.

https://democracy.transportforthenorth.com/documents/s2801/Appendix%20D%20MRTF%20RoadMap.pdf

You are being incredibly optimistic about what you perceive to be the 150s going. Firstly it says "1980s diesel stock". While that is likely to be the 150s first there may be other good reasons for other stock going before them. Secondly, there is a vast difference between replacement beginning in 2023, which might actually mean the start of a procurement process, and them being "gone in a couple of years".

 

[jonesy3001]

You are being incredibly optimistic about what you perceive to be the 150s going. Firstly it says "1980s diesel stock". While that is likely to be the 150s first there may be other good reasons for other stock going before them. Secondly, there is a vast difference between replacement beginning in 2023, which might actually mean the start of a procurement process, and them being "gone in a couple of years".

2023 is a couple of years away as we're in 2021 now.

 

[ScotRail158725]

2023 is a couple of years away as we're in 2021 now.

You missed his point. It was said that procurement may begin in 2023 which means they wont be “getting replaced in a couple of years”

 

[Wolfie]

2023 is a couple of years away as we're in 2021 now.

If you look at the link that you posted it says that procurement may start on 2023. That, based on lots of past precedent, is not consistent with complete replacement (which is what 'gone' would suggest) being done in the same year.

You missed his point. It was said that procurement may begin in 2023 which means they wont be “getting replaced in a couple of years”

Absolutely.

 

[warwickshire]

You are being incredibly optimistic about what you perceive to be the 150s going. Firstly it says "1980s diesel stock". While that is likely to be the 150s first there may be other good reasons for other stock going before them. Secondly, there is a vast difference between replacement beginning in 2023, which might actually mean the start of a procurement process, and them being "gone in a couple of years".

However all said and done.
Don't take any risks.
Yes that takes them up to 2026 approx all gone. However 2026 was the original date anyway for the start off replacement ie mentioned elsewhere for 150 to go.
For the next franchise off when the original arriva northern would have ended.
Anyway especially during mid 2019 to to mid 2020.
Look at how quick the Pacers did go.
And how easy it was to miss the final rides on them.
Sprinters in time ie class 150 will be as just as quick.
So get them in now.
To save bitter disappointment later.
Sprinter replacement time is approaching.

 

[Wolfie]

However all said and done.
Don't take any risks.
Yes that takes them up to 2026 approx all gone. However 2026 was the original date anyway for the start off replacement ie mentioned elsewhere for 150 to go.
For the next franchise off when the original arriva northern would have ended.
Anyway especially during mid 2019 to to mid 2020.
Look at how quick the Pacers did go.
And how easy it was to miss the final rides on them.
Sprinters in time ie class 150 will be as just as quick.
So get them in now.
To save bitter disappointment later.
Sprinter replacement time is approaching.

The slight difference between Sprinters and Pacers is that the former have had the necessary mods and won't be rushed out of service, if necessary without the replacement stock being ready, whatever happens. I agree though that the earliest are on borrowed time.

 

[Class360/1]

Sprinters in time ie class 150 will be as just as quick.
So get them in now.
To save bitter disappointment later.
Sprinter replacement time is approaching.

Don’t be like me with ga 360’s! I left them too late so I never got a final ride on them in Anglian territory

 

[Bletchleyite]

Don’t be like me with ga 360’s! I left them too late so I never got a final ride on them

You can still ride them, just a bit further west!

 

[Class360/1]

You can still ride them, just a bit further west!

I know, I’ll have to give them a ride one day!