Paper tickets vs E-tickets

[infobleep]

If you are able to board a train, using a walk up fare, which is faster, buying an eticket online or buying one from a vending machine?

 

[HST274]

If you are able to board a train, using a walk up fare, which is faster, buying an eticket online or buying one from a vending machine?

For me definitely a tvm but I have not used a Northern one lol. Also especially in bigger stations it isn't exactly comfortable standing there staring at your phone whilst you buy a ticket, but again I prefer paper tickets anyway so am very biased, and haven't bought an e ticket. Instead I go off having bought tickets online at home and being forced to select a specific journey and whether I want a reservation and whether it is an e ticket or paper etc.

 

[py_megapixel]

If you are able to board a train, using a walk up fare, which is faster, buying an eticket online or buying one from a vending machine?

Jokes aside- it genuinely does depend on the vending machine.

A well-designed one, such as those that are used on FirstGroup TOCs - hands down, the TVM wins.
On the rubbish ones used by Northern, I could probably do it quicker on my phone tbh.

 

[Bletchleyite]

If you are able to board a train, using a walk up fare, which is faster, buying an eticket online or buying one from a vending machine?

If it's a Scheidt & Bachmann or Shere machine with the standard UIs provided by those companies, the TVM.

If it's any of that other junk, particularly anything with a journey planner, my phone.

 

[Haywain]

As for kids and cards, there are lots of non-cash options for kids now, such as GoHenry. If I had kids (I don't) I'd rather they carried that sort of thing than cash.

In any event, the number of children travelling unaccompanied and without smartphones, whilst actually wanting to pay, is absolutely tiny.

 

[Techniquest]

Where is my walk-up fare purchase being made? Until infobleep answers the question they pose here:

If you are able to board a train, using a walk up fare, which is faster, buying an eticket online or buying one from a vending machine?

I'll provide my temporary answer. Buying an e-ticket on my phone is far faster. Especially given I can do so before getting out of the armchair, and I can enjoy my breakfast and coffee while buying my ticket. No need to queue up for a potentially non-working TVM, and I can go straight to the ticket barriers.

Let's say I'm near the station and I get the urge to do a journey, whatever reason it might be. Even if this is just outside the ticket office. By the time I've walked through the door, depending on when exactly I started my purchase, I'm already at least halfway through booking. By the time I get to the barriers, I'm tapping away on the payment page. Within 30 seconds I'm waiting for the approval bit, and before I know it I'm all paid and going through the barrier.

Compared to the hassle of digging out my card, tapping away on the TVM to find my destination (by this point I was tapping on my ticket type on the phone and confirming any seat reservations) before confirming via multiple options that I knew what I wanted. By the time it gives me the option to enter my PIN, doing it by e-ticket I'd be through the ticket barrier. Then it's the wait for tickets to print, which can feel like ages. Depending where I am going, and I'm basing this solely on my local station, I could already be on the train by now and waiting to go.

The difference in time might not be much, but quite frankly I'd rather use e-tickets and be done with. Paper tickets are a thing of the past, and the sooner society catches up to that train of thought, the better.

 

[HST274]

Paper tickets are a thing of the past

Yes but it depends why you like them. I quite like keeping them whether from a packed commuter journey or a ticket from a journey on the last GWR HST. I will have to change eventually though I guess.

 

[Techniquest]

Yes but it depends why you like them. I quite like keeping them whether from a packed commuter journey or a ticket from a journey on the last GWR HST. I will have to change eventually though I guess.

For the environmental impact, I cannot accept such a claim as valid for keeping paper tickets around. The sooner we stop using paper tickets the better, although I appreciate this is still years away.

Slowly the coffee shop industry is getting people to use their own reusable cups, and it seems to be making a comeback again now the lockdown is nearly over. One day paper cups will no longer be a thing, again this is years away, and it could be argued takeaway coffee cups hold more value in terms of use than paper tickets. Mind you, paper coffee cups aren't super easy to recycle, which paper train tickets do have the advantage of.

Same sort of principal applies to my love of paper maps. I prefer them for planning, and marking off coverage is just so much easier on a paper map. One day, I will have to sacrifice my preference and go fully to digital maps, but that is a long way off yet.

What I'm saying is that the opportunity to improve the world for the greater good is in our hands, and we should take advantage of this. The same applies to the food and drink industry, the time for permanent change is already here. Getting paper tickets gone is just one small step to a better tomorrow. Changing forever our food habits is a much bigger one, but I'll save that for a different topic...

 

[alistairlees]

Paper train tickets can’t be recycled as they contain a magnetic stripe.

 

[Bletchleyite]

Paper train tickets can’t be recycled as they contain a magnetic stripe.

This would be an advantage of switching TVMs to printing e-tickets - just paper then.

 

[py_megapixel]

Paper train tickets can’t be recycled as they contain a magnetic stripe.

PRT ones don't

 

[alistairlees]

PRT ones don't

Yes, I know. But I was referring to credit card sized tickets (CCST) which is what previous posters were (I think) referring to. These will no doubt be phased out soon.

 

[Haywain]

Mind you, paper coffee cups aren't super easy to recycle, which paper train tickets do have the advantage of.

No such advantage exists where the paper tickets have a magnetic stripe on the back.

 

[py_megapixel]

I must admit I've been absent-mindedly throwing magstripe tickets in the paper recycling for a long time, and I can't be the only one...

 

[scotrail158713]

I must admit I've been absent-mindedly throwing magstripe tickets in the paper recycling for a long time, and I can't be the only one...

I have as well actually. It passes my usual paper test of "can it be torn easily?" so gets put in the recycling. Hadn't really crossed my mind to do otherwise.

 

[johncrossley]

Yes but it depends why you like them. I quite like keeping them whether from a packed commuter journey or a ticket from a journey on the last GWR HST. I will have to change eventually though I guess.

If you were talking about dot matrix printed tickets then I can sort of understand (I've still got tickets from the 90s) but today's thermal print tickets will fade within a few years. Whereas you will always have the booking confirmation of an eTicket.

 

[HST274]

For the environmental impact, I cannot accept such a claim as valid for keeping paper tickets around. The sooner we stop using paper tickets the better, although I appreciate this is still years away.

No such advantage exists where the paper tickets have a magnetic stripe on the back.

This is a good point, actually. However, there will always need to be a form of paper ticket until tablets are handed out freely for only in a complete utopia will every single person own a smart device in the UK I think.

Also I try to collect tickets rather than binning them but I will try to always keep them now to reduce environmental effect.

If you were talking about dot matrix printed tickets then I can sort of understand (I've still got tickets from the 90s) but today's thermal print tickets will fade within a few years. Whereas you will always have the booking confirmation of an eTicket.

A booking confirmation I would not value at all as much as real ticket. I feel a document confirming a transaction is not the same as the 'classic ticket' (but again opinion). Also perhaps it has not been long enough but I do hold tickets from August 2018 (over 2.5 years ago) that have not faded at all.

 

[Haywain]

However, there will always need to be a form of paper ticket until tablets are handed out freely for only in a complete utopia will every single person own a smart device in the UK I think.

In your dreams. There comes a point where you have to adapt, not the industry.

 

[HST274]

In your dreams. There comes a point where you have to adapt, not the industry.

I believe you misunderstood. I was simply stating that I fear not everyone in great Britain will have access to a device until they are handed out freely plus people need an online bank account too. I was neither asking for a free tablet, nor suggesting the industry had to make a such an expensive scheme, nor saying I would refuse to adapt until made to by network rail. I hope this clears any misunderstanding.
Robert

 

[Wallsendmag]

Interestingly the Chiltern version of that TVM allows you to choose a fare without a journey plan and so isn't half as nasty.

But that aside, you could imagine TVMs issuing e-tickets. Or even the station newsagent doing it!

As for kids and cards, there are lots of non-cash options for kids now, such as GoHenry. If I had kids (I don't) I'd rather they carried that sort of thing than cash.

As does ours, the software is the same accross the three TOCs. Currently though we over have popular journeys that don't involve a LNER service as it would bypass the mandatory reservation.

 

[Bletchleyite]

I believe you misunderstood. I was simply stating that I fear not everyone in great Britain will have access to a device until they are handed out freely plus people need an online bank account too.

No, just a debit card.

As does ours, the software is the same accross the three TOCs. Currently though we over have popular journeys that don't involve a LNER service as it would bupass the mandatory reservation.

I'm almost certain the Northern version doesn't allow anything to be bought without planning a journey, but I could have been being rubbish when I had the misfortune of using one.

 

[infobleep]

If it's a Scheidt & Bachmann or Shere machine with the standard UIs provided by those companies, the TVM.

If it's any of that other junk, particularly anything with a journey planner, my phone.

Well, I imagine I'm mostly using a Bachmann or Shere machine.

I'm not against etickets but just mostly find myself with paper tickers from a TVM. Most of my tickets are walk-up tickets as that is what is for sale.

Being able to buy tickets from other stations at a TVM helps and I can do that reasonably quickly when required but I'm not selecting itineraries.

 

[YorksLad12]

No - an eTicket is still an eTicket even if it is printed. It does not become something else.

Excuses, excuses. This happens every time there is a discussion around eTickets. There are a range of ways to buy tickets and a range of ways to fufil tickets. I am sure that at the same time there have always been a few people who have had problems with the way the railways do things. However, ticket offices have seen massive reductions in use over recent years and that is only likely to continue. Meanwhile technology actually allows increasing numbers of people to use other means of ticket purchase. We cannot stand still using technology that is many, many years out of date.

If I print it out and throw it in the bin or set fire to it, it's physical. You can't turn paper off, or fail to read it because it's run out of battery charge.

To be clear, I'm not arguing against technology. I'm done computery things for the last 40 years, and sometimes I've been ahead of the curve. My experience of that is why I don't want to see people left behind, and experience as a passenger is why I want to see the various possible payment methods and ticketing systems linked so that passengers have one account that allows them to chose paper, card, app, downloads, smartcards, Apple Pay, Google Pay, whatever, depending on where they are, what they're doing and which they feel most comfortable with.

 

[Haywain]

If I print it out and throw it in the bin or set fire to it, it's physical

If you do that you have destroyed a piece of paper, not the ticket. The ticket will still exist and can be printed out multiple times if you so choose. With a genuine paper ticket if you set fire to it you destroy the ticket and leave no option other than to buy a new one.

 

[johntea]

As a last resort...does a guards machine allow manual input of a ticket number / booking reference alone to bring up details of an eTicket? Just looking at one I booked with LNER and it clearly states a 11 character alphanumeric ticket number reference

It would be a bit of a faff but write down that code somewhere (even on your hand!), 'sorry my phone is dead but here is the ticket number'

 

[Wallsendmag]

As a last resort...does a guards machine allow manual input of a ticket number / booking reference alone to bring up details of an eTicket? Just looking at one I booked with LNER and it clearly states a 11 character alphanumeric ticket number reference

It would be a bit of a faff but write down that code somewhere (even on your hand!), 'sorry my phone is dead but here is the ticket number'

No, if you're that worried just print the ticket.

 

[johncrossley]

As a backup you could upload the pdf somewhere and so in an emergency you could get a friendly person in the vicinity, such as a guard or a fellow passenger, to load it up on their device.

 

[WelshBluebird]

If you are able to board a train, using a walk up fare, which is faster, buying an eticket online or buying one from a vending machine?

Buying an eticket on my phone is much more convenient. Unless its a longer distance journey that I have planned more in advance (in which case I often get paper tickets anyway), these days I usually buy my tickets on my phone as I am walking to the train station. Much better than having to wait for a TVM or a ticket office counter to become free.

 

[Techniquest]

Paper train tickets can’t be recycled as they contain a magnetic stripe.

No such advantage exists where the paper tickets have a magnetic stripe on the back.

I must admit I've been absent-mindedly throwing magstripe tickets in the paper recycling for a long time, and I can't be the only one...

I have as well actually. It passes my usual paper test of "can it be torn easily?" so gets put in the recycling. Hadn't really crossed my mind to do otherwise.

Oh wow, I did not know that! Like the last two people I've quoted, I've been chucking mine in the recycling for longer than I care to recall. I do wonder if the non-stripe part can be recycled

 

[ThisIsSurbiton]

For the environmental impact, I cannot accept such a claim as valid for keeping paper tickets around. The sooner we stop using paper tickets the better, although I appreciate this is still years away.

Ticket machines (or booking office windows) could issue contactless tickets that can be used again, perhaps for a small charge the first time to encourage reuse. Then we could finally get rid of magnetic stripes and all the mechanical complexity and expense of maintaining ticket barriers to process them. I think there will always be some people for whom planning and buying in advance on a phone won't work.