Stagecoach South & South East

[SeveerYeliab]

I don't *think* they are; the numbers 4 and 6 have been used for many years through. Indeed, before the Triangle route number was established the group was numbered 4, 4A, 6, 6A, 6X. I feel they have decided that they can't go back to that, as routes 4 existed in a different form up until (i think) the last service change, and route 6 still exists. Therefore using 600, 601 etc. instead of 6, 6A etc. seems to be a way of avoiding confusion, due to the fact that the last 7 or so years have seen routes 4, 6 and Triangle take in different routes.

Therefore, I think it is easier for Stagecoach to say they are binning everything and starting with a whole new set of routes, rather than trying to explain how people who currently catch the Triangle will need a route 6, and people who currently catch route 6 need a 6A etc.

 

[M803UYA]

The Canterbury changes are now online with all the new timetables, with details on the Stagecoach website (with a little over a week to go and big changes to the Triangle this does seem a bit late).

Changes can be seen here


Of course, the main change is the Triangle renumbered to 400/401/600/601, with only the 400/600 running between Herne Bay and Whitstable, and Route 6 renumbered to 602/603.

Introduce 4 route numbers to replace one on the Triangle...... how does that not confuse the situation some more then? Triangle has operated for almost 20 years in this form, so would love to know why the change - other than change for the sake of change. You can tell Arriva people are running the show.

 

[SeveerYeliab]

Oh no I fully agree the change of number isn’t necessary, I was just explaining why they will have changed it to 400, 401 etc. rather than to 6,6A.

I feel a lot of this is due to pressure from the local council to serve Estuary View again after the withdrawal of the 4, so they thought there would be too much confusion using one route number for many different routings (although I don’t think this would he too confusing).

 

[NeilCr]

Also, registrations have now come through for the Thanet Changes from June, the headline change of these is the increase of the Thanet Loop frequency from every 10 mins back to its pre-covid every 8 mins (I believe the E200mmcs at Eastbourne will be moving back to Thanet to facilitate this.

Any more details on this?

Rumours going around that there will be changes to the 34 - not going to Minnis Bay any more allegedly

 

[SeveerYeliab]

Any more details on this?

Rumours going around that there will be changes to the 34 - not going to Minnis Bay any more allegedly

Looking at the route start and end points on the new registrations it appears routes 32 and 34 will be partly swapped.

Essentially, Minnis Bay will no longer be served by route 34 and replaced with route 32, and Dane Valley will no longer be served by route 32 and replaced by route 34.

The registrations describe the routes as:
32 Margate - Minnis Bay
34 Margate - Ramsgate via Dane Valley.

32 Registration

32 - Margate to Minnis Bay via Garlinge​

Variation history​

1. • Received19 Apr 24
   • Effective2 Jun 24
   • Registered
   • Routing and timetable adjustments
   Operating between Margate and Minnis Bay given service number 32 effective from 02 June 2024. To amend Route and Timetable.

34 Registration

34 - Ramsgate to Margate Rail Station via Newington, Dane Valley​

Variation history​

1. • Received19 Apr 24
   • Effective2 Jun 24
   • Registered
   • Route and Timetable change
     
   Operating between Ramsgate and Margate Rail Station given service number 34 effective from 02 June 2024. To amend Route and Timetable

 

[NeilCr]

Looking at the route start and end points on the new registrations it appears routes 32 and 34 will be partly swapped.

Essentially, Minnis Bay will no longer be served by route 34 and replaced with route 32, and Dane Valley will no longer be served by route 32 and replaced by route 34.

The registrations describe the routes as:
32 Margate - Minnis Bay
34 Margate - Ramsgate via Dane Valley.

32 Registration


34 Registration

Thank you very much!

 

[Mwanesh]

That's interesting. Personally I very much prefer a number to a meaningless name - something like "Link" would be more suited to a high-frequency interurban route, rather than an hourly rural service linking two minor towns.

The Link was easy for passengers. Though for drivers it was always the 32 because that's what was on the destination board.

 

[LUYMun]

36925, based at Guildford, has been wrapped into RHS Wisley livery consisting of purple/pink (lower), blue (middle) and green (upper) colours. Photo from “Stagecoach in Guildford Fleet List” Facebook Group by Dave Lee Chaston: https://www.facebook.com/share/p/CgzyGhu1rm55AtrF/?mibextid=K35XfP



Stagecoach Portsmouth’s 19099 has also ended up at Aldershot yesterday, and ran local services today. Unsure if on loan or transfer?

 

[nw1]

Are the numbers 400/600 historic to these corridors pre-Triangle?

Seems odd to use such high numbers when everything else in the area seems relatively low.

I do know that East Kent used to have numbers in the 60x range in around 1988 / 1989 when I visited the area.

The university buses, for example, were around 601-604 if I remember right, and all (I think) continued northwards to the coast towns.

 

[duncombec]

I do know that East Kent used to have numbers in the 60x range in around 1988 / 1989 when I visited the area.

The university buses, for example, were around 601-604 if I remember right, and all (I think) continued northwards to the coast towns.

600 series numbers do have a small degree of history in the area, as Canterbury services were allocated numbered in the 600s during the NBC (National Bus Company) era, many of which stayed on for some time afterwards (and indeed, still do in Arriva territory).

However, the 400 was a service between Canterbury, Ashford and Hastings (Hastings was 400s), now the 1 corridor (traditional East Kent number), 2A and 29, and memory escapes me what the 600 did.

It seems more likely that these are variants of the previous 4 and 6 numbers, with 400s being the group of services leaving Canterbury via St Dunstans, the University and Blean, whilst the 600s leave via Sturry.

 

[RDP]

I don't think there ever was a service 600. Service 601 was Canterbury-Ashford until replaced by an extension of the 400. If I recall correctly other routes in the 600 series were

602 Canterbury-Ashford (limited stop), 603 Canterbury-Faversham, 604/5 Canterbury-Whitstable-Herne Bay circular (clockwise), 606/7 Canterbury-Herne Bay-Whitstable-Canterbury circular (anticlockwise) 608 Canterbury-Margate, 610 Canterbury-Ramsgate, 611 Sandwich-Ramsgate, 612/3/4 Canterbury-Deal, 615 Canterbury-Dover, 616/7 Canterbury-Folkestone, 620 Canterbury-Hastingleigh (still runs as such operated by Regent Coaches), 621 Canterbury-Nonington, 622 Canterbury-Plucks Gutter, 625 Canterbury-Seasalter via Tyler Hill, 626 Canterbury-Herne Bay via Hoath, 637/8 Faversham-Whitstable (the latter still runs as such) 645 Herne Bay-Reculver, 660 Faversham-Stalisfield Green (an extended version of this still runs incorporating the former 637 route) 661 Faversham-Chilham, 666 Faversham-Ashford (still runs as such) and 667/8 Canterbury Charing (a truncated service 667 Canterbury-Challock still runs operated by Regent Coaches) while Canterbury city routes used the series 649-659 and the Faversham town service was the 676.

There were almost certainly others not on this list.

 

[OptareOlympus]

Between 1998-2001, the main Canterbury-Whitstable-Herne Bay-Hillborough service was provided by routes 100/101/200/201. Operated by Thanet and Dover depots, these ran direct (not via UKC or Greenhill) as part of the hourly Kent Compass circular which operated both ways around East Kent from Dover - Canterbury - Whitstable- Herne Bay - Margate - Ramsgate - Sandwich - Deal - Dover. Between Canterbury and Hillborough there was a 30 minute frequency and journeys around the full 4 hour circuit operated from 0500 until midnight arguably providing the best bus links the area ever had.

As an aside, the 101/201 was also the first route in East Kent to see low floor operation with Dart SLFs in July 1998.

 

[nw1]

I don't think there ever was a service 600. Service 601 was Canterbury-Ashford until replaced by an extension of the 400. If I recall correctly other routes in the 600 series were

602 Canterbury-Ashford (limited stop), 603 Canterbury-Faversham, 604/5 Canterbury-Whitstable-Herne Bay circular (clockwise), 606/7 Canterbury-Herne Bay-Whitstable-Canterbury circular (anticlockwise) 608 Canterbury-Margate, 610 Canterbury-Ramsgate, 611 Sandwich-Ramsgate, 612/3/4 Canterbury-Deal, 615 Canterbury-Dover, 616/7 Canterbury-Folkestone, 620 Canterbury-Hastingleigh (still runs as such operated by Regent Coaches), 621 Canterbury-Nonington, 622 Canterbury-Plucks Gutter, 625 Canterbury-Seasalter via Tyler Hill, 626 Canterbury-Herne Bay via Hoath, 637/8 Faversham-Whitstable (the latter still runs as such) 645 Herne Bay-Reculver, 660 Faversham-Stalisfield Green (an extended version of this still runs incorporating the former 637 route) 661 Faversham-Chilham, 666 Faversham-Ashford (still runs as such) and 667/8 Canterbury Charing (a truncated service 667 Canterbury-Challock still runs operated by Regent Coaches) while Canterbury city routes used the series 649-659 and the Faversham town service was the 676.

There were almost certainly others not on this list.

Ah ok. For some reason I remember 601 as serving the university but looking at this, perhaps not, it looks like it would have been 604-7.

I do remember actually using the bus (East Kent immediate post-deregulation livery VRs) to get to and from the university.

Conceivable that I saw a 601 in the city centre, and misremembered it as being a university bus.

 

[OptareOlympus]

If I remember rightly, 600 was used internally as the number for the City Centre to Coach Park shuttle (publicly the C7).

 

[LUYMun]

Stagecoach Portsmouth’s 19099 has also ended up at Aldershot yesterday, and ran local services today. Unsure if on loan or transfer?

Confirming from a local Stagecoach staff, as a result of Optare Solo 47307 being withdrawn, 19099 is a permanent transfer to replace that.

 

[timbobean]

Ah ok. For some reason I remember 601 as serving the university but looking at this, perhaps not, it looks like it would have been 604-7.

I do remember actually using the bus (East Kent immediate post-deregulation livery VRs) to get to and from the university.

Conceivable that I saw a 601 in the city centre, and misremembered it as being a university bus.

32 was originally the university shuttle. It became 650 (extended to Thannington) in NBC (National Bus Company) days.

 

[Typhoon]

The Triangle will be ceasing as a route number from 5th May, with services in the Canterbury area revised (known for a while now but the timetables have only just come up on bustimes).

The Triangle will become services 400, 401, 600 & 601, each running every 30 mins (every 60 mins on Sundays), which maintain the current frequency.
Route 400 will not serve the University of Kent (but run via Estuary View, currently only served by route 638 a few times a day after the withdrawal of service 4) - buses will terminate at Greenhill and run through to Canterbury via Herne Bay as a route 600.
Route 401 will continue to serve the University (and not run via Estuary View), but buses will terminate at Tankerton.
Route 600 & 601 will run the current routing, however, service 601 will start from Herne Bay Station (not Greenhill), thus the true loop of the triangle will reduce to every 30 mins.

Also from this date, Route 6 will drop from every 30 mins to every 60 mins and be renumbered to 602 (school journeys numbered 603).

There will also be minor revisions to a few services in Canterbury:
Service 3/X3 will have extra running time added, with more trips running past Faversham to Canterbury.
Service 89 will drop to hourly outside the peaks, and no longer serve Bridge Village.

Canterbury City Services, as well as the numerous school services, will see minor timetable revisions.

The timetables for the new triangle routes are available to view on bustimes here, and registrations for other changes here

Apologies for messing up your thorough description but it is a little more complicated than this. Early morning and evening and all day Sunday the 400 will serve the University but not Estuary View (although it has an Urgent Treatment Centre open seven days a week).

I've included that as I read the following quotes from the Stagecoach website:

Everyone loves the Triangle service, but it can be confusing when buses all have the same route name - whether they are going in one direction or the other, or serving different places at different times.

The main problem is Herne Bay Rail Station, otherwise it depends on which side of the road you are on (much like most routes).

We hope these new arrangements will make travelling by bus even easier and the timetable more resilient to the impacts of roadworks and traffic congestion.

There are four main areas of congestion as far as I can see - the crossings by Canterbury West and Sturry stations, Sturry Road and Whitstable High Street (vehicles loading and unloading) I am not certain what difference the changes will make. Sending the 6 round Broad Oak would have restored the link lost when the 7 was cut, there is a park home site along the way. Sturry has 8 other buses an hour to Canterbury.