Cancellations everyday, delayed. What’s going on with it? I usually use the section between London Bridge - East Croydon/Redhill. But everyday there seems to be a problem. They have been using the excuse shortage of train crew for ages now. These trains are DOO so it can only be drivers. Don’t know why they are so short. Anyone else having similar experiences with them?
-
Our booking engine at tickets.railforums.co.uk (powered by TrainSplit) helps support the running of the forum with every ticket purchase! Find out more and ask any questions/give us feedback in this thread!
What’s going on with Thameslink?
- Thread starter Jturner98
- Start date
- Status
Sponsor Post - registered members do not see these adverts; click here to register, or click here to log in
R
RailUK Forums
londonteacher
Member
- Joined
- 10 Aug 2018
- Messages
- 672
its not just Thameslink, all TOCs seem to be cancelling numerous services as has been detailed on the forum.
It’s summer, so leave is at maximum levels. Unplanned absence rates are also something like three times normal levels. And then with the current good weather, people are less inclined to work their rest days. Add in some industrial relations spice and there are lower levels of availability of crew.
Minstral25
Established Member
I can date it back to Sept 2021. 9R's and 9J's being pulled south of London along the Redhill route for lack of Crew (Although there have been several other issues where lack of crew have meant no replacement services South of river as well). It cannot just be summer but last few weeks have obviously been even worse.
In last 12 weeks RTT has shown many individual services at around 20-25% that have not run. That kind of percentage has been going on for a long time and is really poor.
it goes back to at least 2012…
Minstral25
Established Member
Not really in the same scale, although there were problems then and some were probably due to staff numbers it was not as bad. Mostly linked to using the Quarry line to get trains to catch up on time.
After the fiasco of 2018, along the Redhill route service settled down very well albeit with a couple of Covid interruptions but since end of last year it has been one problem after another which mostly seem to suggest they are drastically short of drivers south of the river.
Urban Gateline
Established Member
- Joined
- 8 Mar 2011
- Messages
- 1,645
Not only south, last 2 Saturdays all they could manage was a PBO-SVG shuttle with poor onward connections, at least last year they were able to just run to Kings Cross when there wasn't sufficient crew to get it to Horsham!
Javelin_55
Member
The 9J** service group is only worked throughout by drivers from two depots (Peterborough and Horsham) so if either is short they end up being run out of King's Cross or London Bridge as there aren't enough spares to keep them going.
Add in some widespread infrastructure problems and you end up with situations like last week where the entire service group was taken out for a couple of days.
Add in some widespread infrastructure problems and you end up with situations like last week where the entire service group was taken out for a couple of days.
Minstral25
Established Member
We had only Redhill to Horsham on both dates - a almost useless service for local stations except as a Gatwick shuttle
WizCastro197
Established Member
Yes
Redhill receives many Thameslink trains per hour but all I've seen there is the majority cancelled and only the Horsham Shuttle and one other Bedford Train leaving.
On Monday 25th July The Horsham Shuttle ran and no Bedford or Peterborough trains (because of extreme heat) so a Normally half full 9:15 Victoria Service formed of only 4 coaches had to cope with an enormous overflow of passengers even on that hot day where less people were travelling, Left Full and Standing. Imagine what it must be on a regular weekday without the supplement of the Thameslinks to help the Southern. But an Irritating part is that this shuttle doesn't extend to ECR where passengers can change for Cambridge and Other Bedford Services via other London Terminals more centrally located then Victoria but instead it terminates at Redhill where passengers then have to travel on full Southern services then change again.
Yes been running for a while now on selected dates assuming where driver shortage is at is highest
Redhill receives many Thameslink trains per hour but all I've seen there is the majority cancelled and only the Horsham Shuttle and one other Bedford Train leaving.
On Monday 25th July The Horsham Shuttle ran and no Bedford or Peterborough trains (because of extreme heat) so a Normally half full 9:15 Victoria Service formed of only 4 coaches had to cope with an enormous overflow of passengers even on that hot day where less people were travelling, Left Full and Standing. Imagine what it must be on a regular weekday without the supplement of the Thameslinks to help the Southern. But an Irritating part is that this shuttle doesn't extend to ECR where passengers can change for Cambridge and Other Bedford Services via other London Terminals more centrally located then Victoria but instead it terminates at Redhill where passengers then have to travel on full Southern services then change again.
Last edited:
Well TL were utterly atrocious last night - massive delays across the network, trains stuck at Stevenage, Knebworth, Sandy etc. for up to 2 hours. The remaining Peterborough - Horsham trains of course all gave up and were cancelled even when trains could take the slow line. No replacement buses in sight either. Had no choice but to wait for about 90 minutes on an LNER 800 just to get to Peterborough, and an inflated taxi down back home.
All because of a bit of hay on the wires between Arlesey and Biggleswade...
Hopefully I won't be dependant on them for getting to work for much longer.
All because of a bit of hay on the wires between Arlesey and Biggleswade...
Hopefully I won't be dependant on them for getting to work for much longer.
Urban Gateline
Established Member
- Joined
- 8 Mar 2011
- Messages
- 1,645
Exactly, it's only really useful for local Journeys, those from Littlehaven and Ifield who can then change at TBD or GTW for another train into London, I do feel for those from Redhill, Merstham and Coulsdon South who lose out!
How is that GTRs fault though? They’ll be advised by Network Rail the line will need to be blocked for engineers to attend to the line? Certain services might be cancelled to take into account the reduced line capacity.
Also could you not see how “a bit of hay” on live electrical lines in the current weather could quite easily turn into a huge fire risk?
WizCastro197
Established Member
What do you mean Redhill Merstham and Coulsdon South lose out? They all have frequent southern services to Victoria?
Like I said in my earlier post we do get train to Bedford and Peterborough at high frequencies but we only get the Horsham shuttle and probably one other London Bound Thameslink train as oppose to our 8tph thameslinks.
Minstral25
Established Member
Except as you mentioned in your post these are 4 coach trains, require changing at East Croydon (not cross platform either) and are often overcrowded without these extra passengers.
Redhill, Coulsdon and Merstham have more than enough traffic alone to justify their 2/4 tph stops on Thameslink services. The Thameslinks disappearing for an hour or more at a time does create many passenger delays on what is supposed to be a turn up and go service.
Or just fire risk, also risk of pulling wires down after getting caught in pantographs.
Hay was up to 6” below contact wire in places
Same here mate, regarding the last bit. I’ve only got to use them for another few weeks before I move to Tonbridge then it’s back to reliable Southeastern.
Hahahhahahaaaahha !
ValleyLines142
Established Member
And with Brighton Pride having taken place this weekend, it was fun!!
Well more reliable that Thameslink anyway from what I’ve seen. I’ll take the lesser or 2 evils.
WizCastro197
Established Member
The 4 Coaches do fine until East Croydon/Purley (off peak) from where most of the passengers alight (ECR) . These 4 coaches then become 8 or 12 from the other service that conjoins at Redhill where the chance of getting a seat is highly likely (with the gained carriages) to ECR either from the Reigate Section or the Gatwick airport part. Sure the Thameslinks absence is irritating but able bodied people can stand for 20 minutes to ECR and change. Its one island platform over its not like you are walking from one end of Clapham to the other.
What Time was it? They occasionally put Southern Brighton bound into Redhill (Sundays Only) but very rarely Thameslink, let alone on Saturdays. Perhaps short notice maintenance on the quarry line?
Anyway It was probably needed. Redhill destinations southbound are really poor. Apart from Maybe Gatwick airport where one can change onto a Brighton service but it's only Thameslink and with the absence of the 2tph from Victoria, these trains stop everywhere and are often seatless by the time it arrives at Gatwick where then more people get on rather than off. I don't think Redhill has gotten a frequent Brighton service since the 2018 timetable change. I am sure Minstral25 lives close to Redhill basing off their amazing knowledge of the surrounding stations and services so maybe they can help me if I'm wrong!
Last edited:
BluePenguin
On Moderation
Thameslink generally have been running fine recently when I have used them. Although there were a few cancellations last Thursday which delayed my friend arriving into London Bridge to meet me
Hardly a Passenger-friendly strategy though, to advise people 'it's likely enough your train will be cancelled you need to check every time'.
I notice this was your first post. Thameslink had absolutely no control over this incident and were left to pick up some very meagre pieces. And that 'bit of hay' could have easily caused a very serious fire or brought down the electrical wires, it was 100% the right thing to do to stop trains and remove it safely.
I genuinely can’t remember the last time I left wherever I was before going to catch a train without checking how it was running first (Since RTT was invented, at least!). It enables me to make best use of my time, or, as Baden Powell said, “ Be Prepared”
It’s fair to say opinion is very much divided on that point.
I prefer to attribute that quote to Scar, but that's just me! Even so, it's still not exactly passenger friendly to say 'expect your train service to be out the window, anything less is a bonus.'
I say this as somebody who planned railtours for 2.5 years. I'm well aware just how much can go wrong, and just how little it takes to spark off major delays.
bramling
Veteran Member
This is absolutely no use if one has a set arrival time that is being aimed for.
Why should people have to bother messing around checking apps or whatever? A decade ago, it was possible to turn up at my local station, and barring the very occasional day when there was disruption, the train would turn up, on time.
My local railway now doesn’t have this facility, quite simply it’s a lottery what runs, and on top of that for one reason or another it seems to be completely up the wall a good proportion of the time. I remember the weekend recently when we couldn’t even travel from Hitchin to Stevenage, one way, as part of a local walk - that’s how utterly useless the service is now.
Of course, this is exactly what one expects with Thameslink. Those of use who had the pleasure of using both Thaneslink and non-Thameslink services in the 90s had first-hand experience of the performance difference between the two. With Thameslink you have more chance of disruption in the first place, and a significantly worse recovery when it does happen. On the GN side things are worse now because many of the residual GN-only services have been pulled from the timetable, so there aren’t even those to be able to rely on.
No wonder my Shell shares are doing well!
Last edited:
Nicholas Lewis
Established Member
Top site although i find combing it with OTT maps as an insurance and then a cross check with Tiger Rail to see if stopping patterns have been altered.
Mark Carne won't go down in the history books for great railway leaders but his agreement to TD data being made open source gave us all these fabulous applications.
To not veer too much off topic the Redhill line needs sorting out that the 9R/9Js automatically back cover each other stops when perturbation is happening
- Status