Worst UK train?

[Class465pacer]

700s. Boooooooring. The only sound you can hear is that car alarm when you arrive and leave stations. Plus they replaced lots of trains that I actually like (319, 377/387, 465)

 

[AM9]

700s. Boooooooring. The only sound you can hear is that car alarm when you arrive and leave stations. Plus they replaced lots of trains that I actually like (319, 377/387, 465)

That's not really true. They don't make any warbling sound when they've got a 20th century power supply, they sound much like Electrostars.

 

[Class465pacer]

That's not really true. They don't make any warbling sound when they've got a 20th century power supply, they sound much like Electrostars.

In fairness I’ve only been on them south of St Pancras

 

[AM9]

The problem with best/worst type of trivia threads like this is that the praise/criticism frequently bears no relevance to a train's fitness for the services on which it is normally deployed. For example, many passengers would prefer the comfort of a Voyager or a Pendolino to a class 700. But I doubt that most passengers would be particularly impressed if a Pendolino turned up at St Pancras platform B as the 17:48 to Bedford, (assuming a normal level of peak hour passengers). The dwells would take 3-4 times as long, the accelration would be pedestrian until beyond Kentish Town, and for every seated passenger, there would be two to three standees, - indeed, I doubt whether the train would be able to clear the platform at all. To put it simply, trains like 700s, 345s and to a lesser degree, Desiro UKs and Electrostars are mass transit devices, they do that well but very few would like to go from Euston to Manchester in a 700 even if it could reach 125mph* to keep within the Pendolino paths.

* It would be an interesting experience but probably only once!

 

[AM9]

In fairness I’ve only been on them south of St Pancras

You might appreciate them a lot more if you went on a fast (say) to St Albans, - a totally different experience and what they were really built for. They are faster away than a 350, 387 or a 444.

 

[86247]

For me its always been 220/221s cramped, always packed solid, and always sat in someone's else's seat which has been reserved on route.And without doubt 150/1s and 150/2s horrible nasty things.

 

[StevieH500]

I've never had a 158 breakdown. The cabs are better than 150's.

I'm not sure what you have been doing but 158's are relatively bulletproof..

They leak air more than a punctured tyre. Numerous door faults as a result. Engines go kaput as well. They are just old and cheaply made time for the scrap yard.

 

[Energy]

700s. Boooooooring. The only sound you can hear is that car alarm when you arrive and leave stations. Plus they replaced lots of trains that I actually like (319, 377/387, 465)

Replacing trains doesn't make them bad, the seats aren't great but other than that they are fairly good in my opinion and do their job well.

 

[Anonymous10]

158s are the devil's spawn. Toilets smell like a sewer, they breakdown all the time, you can break your leg by trapping it under the table as there's no room for your legs unless you are a small child, awful driving cab to sit in. Horrible things

Tfw ones aren't to bad I quite like them

 

[Anonymous10]

For me its always been 220/221s cramped, always packed solid, and always sat in someone's else's seat which has been reserved on route.And without doubt 150/1s and 150/2s horrible nasty things.

Tfw ones aren't to bad I think

 

[86247]

Only ever done TFW ones between crewe and Chester and Chester to Liverpool they do seem better then northern ones but would hate to have one on a longer journey especially when one goes on a Piccadilly to carmarthen service.

 

[superkev]

Northens knees under your chin 155s must be head and shoulders above the rest as the current worse train. Cramped, noisy, high cill line truly awfull things. Even wirsd than the similar 153.
K

 

[DB]

Only ever done TFW ones between crewe and Chester and Chester to Liverpool they do seem better then northern ones but would hate to have one on a longer journey especially when one goes on a Piccadilly to carmarthen service.

They are better than the Northern ones- in particular, they have better seats than the Northern ones are now fitted with (those had the original seats until recently and a few still do - the original seats are OK, but the legroom with them is awful).

 

[EdtheRedEngine]

On a purely personal level, I have to go for the 150s. Pacers are probably objectively worse, but they have a uniformity about them; when you see one pulling in, you know it's going to be some variety of unpleasant. Dogboxes are usually abysmal, but there's enough knocking round with bearable interiors that you can get your hopes up just enough to have them dashed when you find it's actually got those horrid facing benches.

 

[greyman42]

They are just old and cheaply made time for the scrap yard.

What makes you think they were cheaply made?

 

[matacaster]

I would say 142s are probably the worst I've ever been on.

They are in a class of their own!

 

[DB]

They are in a class of their own!

But they come in three flavours!

ex-ATN with 2+2 seats - crap, but probably the most bearable Pacers
Original 3+2 bench seats - even more crap
Merseyrail 3+2 seats - possibly the worst train seats ever made!

 

[StevieH500]

What makes you think they were cheaply made?

The build quality and the fact they were rushed through just before being privatised.

The brakes are an absolute joke hence why during snow you have to do a running brake test more often. They are just 156s made to do 90mph

 

[Islineclear3_1]

Voyagers.

/close thread.

For comfort and ambience:

Voyagers, GWR 800s (hard seats and like sterile travelling theatres), later-batch Class 377's and 375/9's with their cramped ironing-board 3+2 seats virtually throughout

For traction:

Southern 455's now. Had a few break down/struggle to start from the Forest Hill stop in the Down direction

 

[ChilternTurbo]

The problem with best/worst type of trivia threads like this is that the praise/criticism frequently bears no relevance to a train's fitness for the services on which it is normally deployed. For example, many passengers would prefer the comfort of a Voyager or a Pendolino to a class 700. But I doubt that most passengers would be particularly impressed if a Pendolino turned up at St Pancras platform B as the 17:48 to Bedford, (assuming a normal level of peak hour passengers). The dwells would take 3-4 times as long, the accelration would be pedestrian until beyond Kentish Town, and for every seated passenger, there would be two to three standees, - indeed, I doubt whether the train would be able to clear the platform at all. To put it simply, trains like 700s, 345s and to a lesser degree, Desiro UKs and Electrostars are mass transit devices, they do that well but very few would like to go from Euston to Manchester in a 700 even if it could reach 125mph* to keep within the Pendolino paths.

* It would be an interesting experience but probably only once!

That's a very good point. The train enthusiast in me rather enjoyed my commutes on the Chiltern slam door Mk.3 stock set. However the long dwell times at stations as passenger forgot to close the doors, the IC70 seats which I found too low and the general and the assortment of squeaks and groans from the vestibules meant the novelty wore off quite quickly. I actually preferred getting a 'boring' 168 instead as they were much better as a commuter train.

 

[86247]

I don't mind 153s for short journey when I'm out normally i do Victoria to Rochdale on them .Yes the legroom is bad but with most on here the mersey travel 142s were really really bad sat bolt upright,no legroom,and the hardest seats imaginable.

 

[FrodshamJnct]

175s - properly grim units now. They smell, have an awful plastic-y feel to them, and are terribly worn (yes the refurbs are helping slightly) but overall nothing better than a public convenience.

 

[Old Yard Dog]

Pacers, definitely!

And to take the worst of the worst, that would have to be the 142s with Merseyrail seats (possibly the most uncomfortable train seats ever made).

What's wrong with Merseyrail seats? The seats on the 507/508s were awful when they were 3+2 but these were replaced by 2+2 seats many years ago and these are fine.

Interestingly the 2+2 seats on the new 777's will be narrower/closer together to allow more standing room, so will be worse than the units they replace.

I agree that the seats and legroom on the 142's are awful.

I also dislike the 150's. When they were first introduced, they had a low protruding headrest which protruded into your shoulder blades if you were any taller than about 5'10". So much so that I was moved to write to BR to complain - and to thank them for putting a symbol in their timetables to warn passengers which services the awful Sprinters would be used for.

 

[DB]

What's wrong with Merseyrail seats? The seats on the 507/508s were awful when they were 3+2 but these were replaced by 2+2 seats many years ago and these are fine.

I'm referring to the Pacers (142s) with Merseyrail seats - those particular seats are really bad!

 

[StevieH500]

I'm referring to the Pacers (142s) with Merseyrail seats - those particular seats are really bad!

Can't beat the bus seat set up for pacers lol

 

[Mikey C]

If I was to pick one train, the Northern 150s are grim

The Mk3 based MUs are already flawed, with their awful seat/window layout and the large blank wall for the sliding doors. Then add in the roaring diesel engine and the horrible interior - the uniquely bad 3+2 airline seats with terrible legroom

 

[StevieH500]

Best standard class seating 385 then 380

Best 1st class LNER mrk3/4

 

[johnnychips]

Northerns class 170 are very good. Their best DMU.

Agreed.

I can/could normally tolerate Pacers, but the e-Pacer 144 012 was a nightmare: leaks, cracks and stains in the ceiling, rock-hard seats. Hopefully Booth’s are ready with the angle-grinder.

 

[DB]

Agreed.

I can/could normally tolerate Pacers, but the e-Pacer 144 012 was a nightmare: leaks, cracks and stains in the ceiling, rock-hard seats. Hopefully Booth’s are ready with the angle-grinder.

Angle grinders would take too long! Booths seem to use a combination of oxy-acetylene and a grab. Some others, such as Raxstar at Eastleigh and Sims at Hull, seem to largely tear them apart with those hydraulic shears (which no doubt have a proper name!).

 

[triangularq]

I await the citation of anyone actually breaking a leg in that way. You said "you can break a leg" in your initial post, now you've revised that to "almost". Mention of chiropractic treatment which a quick google tells me is an "alternative medicine" accordingto the NHS, i.e. one that hasn't been proven to have any clinical efficacy, doesn't really support your case. You may as well say that 158s are haunted by bad juju.

A family member of mine broke their ankle on the table fitting of a 158 after having a seizure (they suffer with epilepsy). I appreciate it isn’t an every day scenario but speaking from limited personal experience it can be an issue given the perfect storm of circumstances.

As an aside, the (GWR) guard on the service went above and beyond in my opinion that day by phoning me and holding the train at and allowing me onto the service at an intermediate station close to my place of work, and liaising with the emergency services to ensure they received prompt medical attention at Bristol Temple Meads. Don’t know if he reads this forum, but if he does he knows who he is.

I did provide this feedback to GWR and can only hope he received a slap on the back and a nice bottle of something for the trouble.