First West of England (Bristol, Bath & The West)

[stait.john]

Do you know what any of the changes to the 8/24/36 are, or any further details on the 5/15/41/77?

No details at present I’m afraid.

 

[Callum15632]

No details at present I’m afraid.

Do you know when we will find out?

 

[CD]

Some new routes coming in to bolster frequency on key routes, with 12 B9s coming from Oldham.

Changes to 8, 24, 36, new 5, 15, 41, 77, I’ve heard 48A renumbered to 46, some 48 journeys diverted via Oldbury Court and numbered 47.

Do you mean a 2nd 77 route or changes to the existing route (77 Wells-Yeovil) that we have been expecting?

 

[Callum15632]

Do you mean a 2nd 77 route or changes to the existing route (77 Wells-Yeovil) that we have been expecting?

New 77 route I think.

 

[TheGrandWazoo]

I think it's nuts that the 74 has a frequency 3 buses per hour and the 73 only has a frequency of 2 buses per hour, despite the fact that the 73 is cross-city and the 74 is so similar but considerably shorter.

I'd imagine that it's all down to demand.

The southern part of the 73 has struggled over recent years (hence the 51 Wessex episode). The northern part around Sadly Broke is much reduced since the m1 appeared. Doubt it would be sustainable, especially with it being a much longer route, increasing it to every 20 mins would need another 3 or 4 vehicles.

 

[LeylandLynx]

I'd imagine that it's all down to demand.

The southern part of the 73 has struggled over recent years (hence the 51 Wessex episode). The northern part around Sadly Broke is much reduced since the m1 appeared. Doubt it would be sustainable, especially with it being a much longer route, increasing it to every 20 mins would need another 3 or 4 vehicles.

I think it would be sustainable, if done with care. Several years ago First suggested rerouting it down the M32 and through the Stoke Gifford Bypass (maybe it should go that way so it doesn't have to go under that dodgy bridge at Parkway).

 

[Citistar]

I'd imagine that it's all down to demand.

The southern part of the 73 has struggled over recent years (hence the 51 Wessex episode). The northern part around Sadly Broke is much reduced since the m1 appeared.

And the (currently) heavily subsidised T1 which is even quicker than the M1. The whole raison d'etre for the 73 continuing to serve north of Parkway is based upon demand to go to Filton Avenue and Gloucester Road, for which half hourly seems pretty much adequate in the current climate.

 

[-Colly405-]

Agreed; I was trying to work out how best to say it, and what you've said is what I was going to say...

I think of it simply that as far as Filton Ave is concerned the 70/74 are it's main services, every 10 mins, and the 73 is a half hourly extra aimed at Sadly and Parkway passengers from the Ave!

 

[Private Baxter]

Some new routes coming in to bolster frequency on key routes, with 12 B9s coming from Oldham.

Changes to 8, 24, 36, new 5, 15, 41, 77, I’ve heard 48A renumbered to 46, some 48 journeys diverted via Oldbury Court and numbered 47.

Interesting sounding changes coming up - how many different 77s will Bristol have had by then?!

Curious about some of the forthcoming routes, but whatever they are I hope is a step in the right direction following several years of cuts.

And 48A to 46 seems like a sensible renumbering. In fact I think there were plans some years ago to renumber it 47, although that might just be my imaginiation.

 

[Martin2012]

Ended up in Wells last night and saw a number of First buses parked together in an area towards the back of the bus station.

I asked my 376 driver about this and he told me that there is insufficient space in Wells Depot for all the buses to be parked there.

Can anyone advise me how long this arrangement has been in place as I thought Wells already had an outstation for parking buses?

 

[Private Baxter]

Ended up in Wells last night and saw a number of First buses parked together in an area towards the back of the bus station.

I asked my 376 driver about this and he told me that there is insufficient space in Wells Depot for all the buses to be parked there.

Can anyone advise me how long this arrangement has been in place as I thought Wells already had an outstation for parking buses?

Yes, this seems to have been going on for some months now. For years the depot has not had enough space, so about a third of the fleet would typically park at a site behind the cold store over night, but development there in recent years has seen this arrangement stopped. (I don't k ow the details, and is more of an assumption). These days the deckers tend to be in the depot, whilst the streetlites and other single decks use the coach station.

 

[-Colly405-]

Interesting sounding changes coming up - how many different 77s will Bristol have had by then?!

Curious about some of the forthcoming routes, but whatever they are I hope is a step in the right direction following several years of cuts.

And 48A to 46 seems like a sensible renumbering. In fact I think there were plans some years ago to renumber it 47, although that might just be my imaginiation.

I always thought that the 48a would sit better as the 50, linking in tens nicely with the 70.

The one I'm intrigued by is the new 15. Most of the others have had something by that number recently, or are next to an existing number. But I can't remember a 15 in all the time I've lived in Bristol (since 1993), and there is no 14 or 16. The closest to a 15 I can think of was the 515, the subsidised version of the 5A back in the day...

 

[Whiteway215]

I always thought that the 48a would sit better as the 50, linking in tens nicely with the 70.

The one I'm intrigued by is the new 15. Most of the others have had something by that number recently, or are next to an existing number. But I can't remember a 15 in all the time I've lived in Bristol (since 1993), and there is no 14 or 16. The closest to a 15 I can think of was the 515, the subsidised version of the 5A back in the day...

Are all these service numbers necessarily Bristol? Could they be routes in Bath, Weston or Wells?

 

[LeylandLynx]

And the (currently) heavily subsidised T1 which is even quicker than the M1. The whole raison d'etre for the 73 continuing to serve north of Parkway is based upon demand to go to Filton Avenue and Gloucester Road, for which half hourly seems pretty much adequate in the current climate.

All things being equal, frequency trumps pretty much everything else in generating demand, including speed, unless the frequency is already high. The m1 has both so it has a massive advantage.

I don't know what the ridership-frequency elasticity is for the 73, but it's potentially pretty high since it's cross-city and only 2 buses per hour (it usually is pretty high on these types of services).

The frequency is too low for it to be useful cross-city travel, really.

 

[-Colly405-]

Are all these service numbers necessarily Bristol? Could they be routes in Bath, Weston or Wells?

Honestly hadn't thought of that but I can't see it being WSM (as their local services aren't numbered that high yet) or Wells (for the opposite reason!). But Bath, possibly!

All things being equal, frequency trumps pretty much everything else in generating demand, including speed, unless the frequency is already high. The m1 has both so it has a massive advantage.

I don't know what the ridership-frequency elasticity is for the 73, but it's potentially pretty high since it's cross-city and only 2 buses per hour (it usually is pretty high on these types of services).

The frequency is too low for it to be useful cross-city travel, really.

The 73 is a strange route - it's had much of its (northern) ridership removed, but still meets a need. Having dropped from every 15 minutes to every 20 and now every 30, clearly most of its former ridership has deserted it to the m1, T1 or m4. It feels that as it is really a secondary route on the north side, that half-hourly is about right. And as far as the south side is concerned, half hourly is a premier service

 

[LeylandLynx]

Honestly hadn't thought of that but I can't see it being WSM (as their local services aren't numbered that high yet) or Wells (for the opposite reason!). But Bath, possibly!

The 73 is a strange route - it's had much of its (northern) ridership removed, but still meets a need. Having dropped from every 15 minutes to every 20 and now every 30, clearly most of its former ridership has deserted it to the m1, T1 or m4. It feels that as it is really a secondary route on the north side, that half-hourly is about right. And as far as the south side is concerned, half hourly is a premier service

The 72 must be a tertiary service then at best.

 

[Whiteway215]

Honestly hadn't thought of that but I can't see it being WSM (as their local services aren't numbered that high yet) or Wells (for the opposite reason!). But Bath, possibly!

The 73 is a strange route - it's had much of its (northern) ridership removed, but still meets a need. Having dropped from every 15 minutes to every 20 and now every 30, clearly most of its former ridership has deserted it to the m1, T1 or m4. It feels that as it is really a secondary route on the north side, that half-hourly is about right. And as far as the south side is concerned, half hourly is a premier service

There was a 15/215 in Bath that ran from City Centre (Terrace Walk)-Bear Flat-Whiteway (Haycombe Cemetery)
But that was withdrawn in October 1980 under the Market Analysis Project changes of the time.
The 15 route number may have been used since but I can’t remember if it has.

There will be a new service to replace the existing 22 (Post 31347) and that will operate in the Whiteway/Southdown area to University of Bath so I wonder if that service will be the 15.

 

[stait.john]

Yes the new 15, 47, 77 are all Bristol services. 48a becomes 46.

 

[Will1am]

There was a 15/215 in Bath that ran from City Centre (Terrace Walk)-Bear Flat-Whiteway (Haycombe Cemetery)
But that was withdrawn in October 1980 under the Market Analysis Project changes of the time.
The 15 route number may have been used since but I can’t remember if it has.

There will be a new service to replace the existing 22 (Post 31347) and that will operate in the Whiteway/Southdown area to University of Bath so I wonder if that service will be the 15.

It was prev. mentioned the 22 will be transferring to First

 

[Whiteway215]

Yes the new 15, 47, 77 are all Bristol services. The 36 is extended to Clifton Christchurch and renumbered 5. 48a becomes 46.

15 is a peak hour only service servicing Avonmouth Smoke Lane and it’s estate up to Cribbs.

Thanks for confirming that John

 

[Will1am]

Yes the new 15, 47, 77 are all Bristol services. The 36 is extended to Clifton Christchurch and renumbered 5. 48a becomes 46.

15 is a peak hour only service servicing Avonmouth Smoke Lane and it’s estate up to Cribbs.

Was the previously mentioned 41 route a mishearing?

 

[-Colly405-]

There was a 15/215 in Bath that ran from City Centre (Terrace Walk)-Bear Flat-Whiteway (Haycombe Cemetery)

Hence your username, perchance?

 

[Whiteway215]

Hence your username, perchance?

Absolutely sir!

 

[Simon75]

Yes, this seems to have been going on for some months now. For years the depot has not had enough space, so about a third of the fleet would typically park at a site behind the cold store over night, but development there in recent years has seen this arrangement stopped. (I don't k ow the details, and is more of an assumption). These days the deckers tend to be in the depot, whilst the streetlites and other single decks use the coach station.

Haven't first thought about about building a bigger depot? Have they always had the same site?

 

[stait.john]

No details at present

 

[Callum15632]

No I forgot that one. 41 is the Kingswood shorts on the 43 renumbered and extended to Avonmouth via Portway.

What is the 77?

 

[LeylandLynx]

What is the 77?

Could it be a renumbering of the 24? Or an auxiliary to the 76?

 

[Marcus Fryer]

Could it be a renumbering of the 24? Or an auxiliary to the 76?

Or a variation on the 75 to run via Brabazon?

 

[stait.john]

What is the 77?

No details at present.

 

[Callum15632]

77: Henleaze Lake Road via the 2/2a route to City then via the 75/76 route to Muller Road Top.

Thank you for letting us know