First West Yorkshire & York discussion

[Ant158]

Every 10 minutes to every 12 is not poor at all... if they can operate all journeys that it.

In Leeds some of our core routes have gone from every 7/8 or every 10 minutes to every 15 minutes or worse in some circumstances.

Some areas that uses to have a great frequency (Ilkley to Otley for example) were going to lose their service entirely until the bus grant was extended.

Poor is probably the wrong word I used there. That’s the key if they run all journeys! Every 12 is ok, not really the turn up and go frequency of every 10, though a bus/es missing is more noticeable and can mean nearer to a 20/30 min wait.

Though buses every 12 mins in York probably reduces the congestion that some of the routes used to face. Another thing that probably makes it more noticeable is that due to route changes in the city centre over recent years, buses can be seen more often in other places. (I do find myself comparing the network to what it was like between 2006 and 2009) so obviously the changes will appear quite different.

 

[Seehof]

Since my local York route (1) has been reduced to every 15 minutes it is much more reliable. The core to running any bus route reliably or frequently is staff which we all know are difficult to recruit and train.
Personally, I don’t think we are too bad here in York compared to other places I have lived including in both towns and the country.

 

[Andyh82]

Interesting observation in York (Saturday). Having not visited York for a while it was interesting to note how few buses there appeared to be bussing around compared to recent years.

Looking at some of the bus stops seeing services are now every 12 mins etc that were for years every 10 is poor. For example waited nearly 20 mins for a 7 on the Park & Ride.

I think what you describe has happened in every town in the country

Even places like Edinburgh and Nottingham have seen frequencies and PVRs slashed since Covid, with services dropping back one or two frequency tiers.

 

[Kieran1990]

Every 10 minutes to every 12 is not poor at all... if they can operate all journeys that it.

In Leeds some of our core routes have gone from every 7/8 or every 10 minutes to every 15 minutes or worse in some circumstances.

Some areas that uses to have a great frequency (Ilkley to Otley for example) were going to lose their service entirely until the bus grant was extended.

The cut backs on the Leeds services really do show how much first don’t have the drivers or the cash to maintain it. The 16 is always rather comfy these days with only a 15 min frequency compared to its pre-covid 7-8 frequency
I’d say since the capped fares loadings have been greater both off-peak and peak and the Sat service of 3 an hour is inadequate

 

[Markk1990]

It’s important to note that although a reduction in frequency is generally not good news if all other service factors remain, that a bus now every 15 mins instead of every 10 mins guaranteed* to show rather than one of every 10 mins not guaranteed to show is more likely to at least stem any passenger and income losses than lose any.

People can deal with a less frequent reliable service but faith in buses disappears when your service doesn’t show for half an hour when it should be every 10 mins

 

[WAB]

Every 15 minutes is alright, but less than that is not frequent at all, and only useful if your journey requires no changes onto another bus or a train. Evening and weekend frequencies are not good at all, and reliability is still not up to scratch in many places, and hasn't been for quite some time.

One thing is for sure, Arriva and First in West Yorkshire seem to be sinking into the mire, with a shortage of drivers, uncared for fleets, dire passenger information, and a very contracted network.

 

[Seehof]

I am not able to get into York at the moment. Can anyone tell me if Streetdecks are now on Uni services. What numbers are they? Have any York buses been withdrawn or plan to be? Thank you.

 

[dazzler]

I am not able to get into York at the moment. Can anyone tell me if Streetdecks are now on Uni services. What numbers are they? Have any York buses been withdrawn or plan to be? Thank you.

They certainly are on the Uni services, I saw several this morning whilst I was at work. Two of them appear to be numbered 35930 & 35931, I'm not close enough to the Sport Village bus stop to see the numbers on the others, sadly.

First photo is of the rear of 35931 at the York Sport Village Bus Stop.
Second photo is of 35930 at the York Sport Village Bus Stop.

Photos are screenshots from my bike camera.

.

 

[Seehof]

Thank you. Definitely have to get there soon!

 

[APT618S]

I am not able to get into York at the moment. Can anyone tell me if Streetdecks are now on Uni services. What numbers are they? Have any York buses been withdrawn or plan to be? Thank you.

According to bustimes 35927-35931 are at York now and all are out on the 66/67 today (8th Nov):

Fleet list – First York – bustimes.org

 

[Jordan Adam]

I am not able to get into York at the moment. Can anyone tell me if Streetdecks are now on Uni services. What numbers are they? Have any York buses been withdrawn or plan to be? Thank you.

35927-34 are the numbers for the York Streetdecks.

 

[dodecahedron67]

No buses to be withdrawn. As I’ve said many times before

 

[noddingdonkey]

Do my eyes deceive me or did I just see a new 72 plate single decker (StreetLite?) on the 183 Marsden Huddersfield? Looked like a possibly unfinished livery with an all white front end and the typical First stripes on the back.

 

[APT618S]

Do my eyes deceive me or did I just see a new 72 plate single decker (StreetLite?) on the 183 Marsden Huddersfield? Looked like a possibly unfinished livery with an all white front end and the typical First stripes on the back.

It will have been 63437 MF72 WCK:

63437 - MF72 WCK

Wright StreetLite DF

bustimes.org

There are 3 others (63434-436).

 

[dodecahedron67]

Changes in York, as of today 6s are now booked to be double deckers (07/57 plate uni buses) and no longer interwork with the hospital bus

Hopefully improve the reliability of 6s but who knows

 

[aswilliamsuk]

Do my eyes deceive me or did I just see a new 72 plate single decker (StreetLite?) on the 183 Marsden Huddersfield? Looked like a possibly unfinished livery with an all white front end and the typical First stripes on the back.

There are ten StreetLites coming for Huddersfield (63434-43). Interestingly - despite 'deckers continuing to be outshopped in HD Connect livery with the lighter blue front - these StreetLites have all arrived in base urban colours, without the blue front.

Either way, good to see investment in the Huddersfield fleet again after some years.

(York are getting 12 StreetDecks for Uni work - 35927-38. 35938 appears to be in a new First York livery, with a navy blue base and red flashes in standard First Urban layout: https://www.flickr.com/photos/dmc1947/52474717631/in/faves-64504275@N06/)

 

[Andyh82]

There are ten StreetLites coming for Huddersfield (63434-43). Interestingly - despite 'deckers continuing to be outshopped in HD Connect livery with the lighter blue front - these StreetLites have all arrived in base urban colours, without the blue front.

Either way, good to see investment in the Huddersfield fleet again after some years.

(York are getting 12 StreetDecks for Uni work - 35927-38. 35938 appears to be in a new First York livery, with a navy blue base and red flashes in standard First Urban layout: https://www.flickr.com/photos/dmc1947/52474717631/in/faves-64504275@N06/)

All I can say about that, is I hope it looks better in the flesh

I also thought the park and ride was supposed to be a different livery to stand out from the normal fleet, that loses its impact if the main fleet is going to be navy blue as well

 

[dodecahedron67]

All I can say about that, is I hope it looks better in the flesh

I also thought the park and ride was supposed to be a different livery to stand out from the normal fleet, that loses its impact if the main fleet is going to be navy blue as well

The blue/red looks a lot better in person - I can confirm

4 in new City livery for city duties only, none in service so far
8 in uni livery for 66/67, all of which are already in service

P+R is blue/copper so still different to the blue/red city livery

 

[Andyh82]

I was in York today and I’m thinking the Park and Ride is not going to be able to cope in the run up to Christmas.

Traditionally services were every 10 mins and before Christmas they even used to sometimes deploy extra buses. Now frequencies are reduced and buses are missing, and as a result queues for buses in the city centre were stretching half way down the street at all the various stops the Park and Ride serves

 

[dodecahedron67]

I was in York today and I’m thinking the Park and Ride is not going to be able to cope in the run up to Christmas.

Traditionally services were every 10 mins and before Christmas they even used to sometimes deploy extra buses. Now frequencies are reduced and buses are missing, and as a result queues for buses in the city centre were stretching half way down the street at all the various stops the Park and Ride serves

It was chaos today. It was taking 20 minutes just to get through stonebow - extra buses/increased frequencies only help so much when going one stop is half your total running time for a round trip!

(FYI, there were extra buses today - 2 on 7s, 2 on 8s for a few hours and 1 on 2s for an hour or so in the morning. Also a bus swap to give a bendy to 8s to be able to load/unload faster)

 

[Seehof]

Very sad to read - apparently neither the roads/car parks and buses could cope. Next Saturday is a rail strike day I believe which, in theory, will make matters worse.
A friend had to wait 30 minutes in the afternoon for a 7.
I will be going into York on Monday so I look forward to seeing the new Uni buses.

Poor York! Dalton Terrace is closed due to emergency road works and likely to remain closed until the second week of December. No buses go down there but due to the phasing of the lights and the way they work at the Blossom Street/Holgate road junction delays up to 30 minutes are being experienced. The 1, 5, 5A, 16, 24 and some out of town buses that use the Holgate road are now going to be very heavily delayed.

 

[Andyh82]

The Leeds Park and Ride was struggling to cope today

First are running a reduced frequency of every 15 minutes due to the driver shortage

Traffic around the south side of Leeds was very congested due to the City Square closure with car drivers queuing towards dead ends on all approaches

As a result the PR1 was running way behind schedule and taking twice as long to do a loop than they are meant to do. At one point both vehicles were running together leaving gaps of over half an hour between buses

 

[northernchris]

The Leeds Park and Ride was struggling to cope today

First are running a reduced frequency of every 15 minutes due to the driver shortage

Traffic around the south side of Leeds was very congested due to the City Square closure with car drivers queuing towards dead ends on all approaches

As a result the PR1 was running way behind schedule and taking twice as long to do a loop than they are meant to do. At one point both vehicles were running together leaving gaps of over half an hour between buses

Leeds was well and truly snarled up this afternoon! As well as the multiple roadworks there seemed to be lots of queues around car parks which was then stretching back on the main roads delaying the rest of the traffic. Things were further disrupted when New York Street was closed after a pedestrian was knocked down on the crossing outside the Mecca Bingo with Eastgate resembling a bus park when I walked by around 4.30.

 

[Harvey10]

I’ve heard on the grapevine that First York have plans for service enhancements next year such as service 1 to every 10mins, Service 6 to every 12mins.

Just wondering if anyone has any confirmation of the above or is it just another rumour?

 

[dodecahedron67]

I’ve heard on the grapevine that First York have plans for service enhancements next year such as service 1 to every 10mins, Service 6 to every 12mins.

Just wondering if anyone has any confirmation of the above or is it just another rumour?

Rumour afaik. If anything, it would be the park and rides or uni services that go up in frequency first

 

[Seehof]

The York Streetdecks, including the Uni liveried ones, are turning up on any York double deck operated route albeit no more than one or two vehicles on each route.

 

[dodecahedron67]

The York Streetdecks, including the Uni liveried ones, are turning up on any York double deck operated route albeit no more than one or two vehicles on each route.

Current allocations for the streetdecks are 2x city livery for 9s, 5x uni for 66/67, 5x uni/city for 1/4/5/6 I believe

 

[Seehof]

Thank you. It is just been announced publicly that First will stop operating York route 12 from
22 January and at the same time route 10 will be reduced from every 30 minutes to 40.

 

[mlambeuk]

Thank you. It is just been announced publicly that First will stop operating York route 12 from
22 January and at the same time route 10 will be reduced from every 30 minutes to 40.

Also Number 11 Reduced to every 45 minutes from every 30 minutes.

 

[Seehof]

Thanks again. That begs the question as to whether some buses will be removed from the fleet!