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GWR Class 800

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Peter Sarf

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Having now been inside units 1, 2 and 4 on test, they are VERY quiet on diesel, certainly nothing like a Voyager.

That sounds rather promising.

How much quieter were Voyagers when they were new ?.

How do 800s compare to the likes of Sprinters when they were new ?. But also now the sprinters are old ?.

Will have to wait and see what they are like with uprated engines of course or, failing that, what the 802s are like.
 
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Clarence Yard

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That sounds rather promising.

How much quieter were Voyagers when they were new ?.

How do 800s compare to the likes of Sprinters when they were new ?. But also now the sprinters are old ?.

Will have to wait and see what they are like with uprated engines of course or, failing that, what the 802s are like.

They are in a completely different league to Sprinters, Turbos or Voyagers when they were new.

Some of my journeys in 800 stock have been with the uprated engines and there was no noticeable interior noise difference between the two engine settings. Both very, very quiet.
 

D1009

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Not good that Roger Ford of Modern Railways considers in his Informed Sources column preview of today, that a Chiltern class 168 "knocks spots off" an IEP for seat comfort and general ambiance in standard class.
Has the "general ambience" of the IEP yet been finalised, given that many of the units so far built are without seats? I still believe Roger Ford is doing his best to be critical of the project at every opportunity.
 

800001

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Has the "general ambience" of the IEP yet been finalised, given that many of the units so far built are without seats? I still believe Roger Ford is doing his best to be critical of the project at every opportunity.

Only 2 units 800001 and 800101 that do not have seats fitted I believe. Although 101 did look like seats were fitted and covered over with exception of one coach where the test guys were sitting with all there equipment. (blinds were open on a couple of carriages).

800002 looked like it had seats fitted when I looked in it last week.

003, and 004 have all internal fittings fitted.

800005 which has been sat out side Hitachi factory for last couple of weeks has all its seats and internal equipment fitted.
 

leomartin125

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Considering a lot of testing on many routes of the GWML still needs to be explored by the IEP, the likes of Wales and the Cotswolds especially, North Pole and Stoke Gifford IEP Depot's have been very quiet recently... For a train entering service in Autumn on god knows what routes, they seem very far behind schedule... surely? Anyone know what Hitachi are up to?
 

hwl

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Considering a lot of testing on many routes of the GWML still needs to be explored by the IEP, the likes of Wales and the Cotswolds especially, North Pole and Stoke Gifford IEP Depot's have been very quiet recently... For a train entering service in Autumn on god knows what routes, they seem very far behind schedule... surely? Anyone know what Hitachi are up to?

It could be clearance works and platform extension needed on those routes and they aren't scheduled to complete for another few months so no point in thinking about test run yet. Test runs on (initially) diesel routes shouldn't throw up many surprises (hopefully).

Given recent progress on electrification Stockley - Maidenhead and Maidenhead - Reading they will probably be looking at test running from the wires on Didcot - Paddington in the summer. Therefore may be hold off on route testing and spend time and resources in the short term getting a decent number of units bug free on the test track and ECML without getting in the way of electrification on the GWML?
 

superalbs

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Well considering the IEP interior spec is apparently not finalised, I fail to see much point in fitting them out with the current, awful, metro-style seating.
 

YorkshireBear

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It could be clearance works and platform extension needed on those routes and they aren't scheduled to complete for another few months so no point in thinking about test run yet. Test runs on (initially) diesel routes shouldn't throw up many surprises (hopefully).

Given recent progress on electrification Stockley - Maidenhead and Maidenhead - Reading they will probably be looking at test running from the wires on Didcot - Paddington in the summer. Therefore may be hold off on route testing and spend time and resources in the short term getting a decent number of units bug free on the test track and ECML without getting in the way of electrification on the GWML?

They also are working their socks off to stop the inteference problems they have been having i imagine!
 

Envoy

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Would it not be prudent to get one kitted out and running with real passengers say between Taunton & Cardiff? This would hopefully show that everything was OK or highlight possible problems such as poor seats, blocked toilets etc. prior to a whole fleet being fitted out?

I also wonder about what type of tinted glass will be used? Some tints are horrible and make the countryside look gloomy - even on sunny days.

The Voyager seats are terrible and set far too low to the floor. The cream seat backs also reflect in the windows. Such mistakes, I would not like to see repeated on the 800’s.
 

JN114

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There's a lot of misunderstanding about what phase of IEP introduction we're at.

At the moment, all the units are with Hitachi, undergoing their acceptance testing. That is done on a handful of core routes which provide the test conditions required for the test. There's no benefit to testing in Cardiff or Scotland or on the Cotswold line at this stage because they don't offer any differences over the existing test areas. Hitachi are not responsible for any kind of route proving running, that will be down to GWR and VTEC once they have units and qualified drivers on their books.

Once Hitachi have finished their acceptance testing the units will be delivered to GWR and VTEC. Traincrews will learn the traction and THEN (and only then) will we see route proving testing. It will likely be done overnight as it involves extended dwell times at stations checking stepping distances, DOO equipment and so on. Only a small handful of return trips will be required over each route.

The interference issue is delaying delivery to GWR, which was due to happen around about now.
 

JN114

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Would it not be prudent to get one kitted out and running with real passengers say between Taunton & Cardiff? This would hopefully show that everything was OK or highlight possible problems such as poor seats, blocked toilets etc. prior to a whole fleet being fitted out?

I also wonder about what type of tinted glass will be used? Some tints are horrible and make the countryside look gloomy - even on sunny days.

The Voyager seats are terrible and set far too low to the floor. The cream seat backs also reflect in the windows. Such mistakes, I would not like to see repeated on the 800’s.

Even if Hitachi delivered the first unit to GWR today, There's still several months of work route proving, driver training, fitting out and so on before they're ready to enter passenger service. There would be little point doing a soft introduction on a route they won't operate in regular service - you'd be training up drivers to work them just for those couple of months before they go back on to Main Line duties. Waste of time and money.

The interior is specified by DfT - a public trial isn't going to change it.
 
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800001

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Only 2 units 800001 and 800101 that do not have seats fitted I believe. Although 101 did look like seats were fitted and covered over with exception of one coach where the test guys were sitting with all there equipment. (blinds were open on a couple of carriages).

800002 looked like it had seats fitted when I looked in it last week.

003, and 004 have all internal fittings fitted.

800005 which has been sat out side Hitachi factory for last couple of weeks has all its seats and internal equipment fitted.

800002 is currently sat outside Hitachi at Newton Aycliffe, all seats fitted, with exception of about 1/4 of one coach.
 

Envoy

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The interior is specified by DfT - a public trial isn't going to change it.

So if the DfT have got things wrong and the public all start moaning about this & that, we are going to have to live with it? Far better to get one unit on test with real passengers - who can leave comments - rather than bang out a whole fleet of these trains with possible flaws?
 

JN114

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So if the DfT have got things wrong and the public all start moaning about this & that, we are going to have to live with it? Far better to get one unit on test with real passengers - who can leave comments - rather than bang out a whole fleet of these trains with possible flaws?

A whole fleet of them is already being "banged out" The delays to the whole project (and increased costs) would be eye-watering. If we then waited for some public consultation to conclude. Interior comfort is so subjective.
 

WatcherZero

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So if the DfT have got things wrong and the public all start moaning about this & that, we are going to have to live with it? Far better to get one unit on test with real passengers - who can leave comments - rather than bang out a whole fleet of these trains with possible flaws?

Long lead times, even simple stuff can have to be ordered two years before delivery. Some of the more complex electricals/engines have to be ordered even earlier. You sometimes see minor changes half way through a production run (say two years after first delivery) arising from early in service experience.
 
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spark001uk

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800002 is currently sat outside Hitachi at Newton Aycliffe, all seats fitted, with exception of about 1/4 of one coach.

That slipped away quietly! (I took pics/vid of it at Reading about 3 weeks ago where it was on test)

On the point of noise, on said evening it passed right by me on the platform, and I would say the sound/volume is more or less like a voyager.
 
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hwl

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So if the DfT have got things wrong and the public all start moaning about this & that, we are going to have to live with it? Far better to get one unit on test with real passengers - who can leave comments - rather than bang out a whole fleet of these trains with possible flaws?

Some of the public are going to moan anyway and you won't be able to keep everyone happy so not much point. They started the design process with lesson learned from other rolling stock (e.g. voyagers toilet smell issues) so they have taken feedback on board just in different way.
 

800001

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That slipped away quietly! (I took pics/vid of it at Reading about 3 weeks ago where it was on test)

On the point of noise, on said evening it passed right by me on the platform, and I would say the sound/volume is more or less like a voyager.

It's been based at Doncaster for about 2 weeks, been doing tests between there and Darlington. It arrived early Monday morning I believe.
 

YorkshireBear

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That slipped away quietly! (I took pics/vid of it at Reading about 3 weeks ago where it was on test)

On the point of noise, on said evening it passed right by me on the platform, and I would say the sound/volume is more or less like a voyager.

Might be quieter inside though!
 

ainsworth74

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And a lot less of a toilet smell I hope! ;)

Ahem :lol:

IEP Train Technical Specification said:
TS1675

The toilet system shall limit the presence of odours within the toilet cubicle and prevent their escape into surrounding passenger areas including vestibules when the toilet door is closed. The passenger saloon must be free from toilet odours at all times.
 

spark001uk

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Good to know. I didn't much doubt it tbh. Obviously wasn't in the spec for the voyagers then!
 

gsnedders

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I was about to say is this a spec built on experience?!! ;)

Pretty much. The number of "annoyances" in other modern rolling-stock explicitly forbidden in IEP spec is pretty amazing, though it obviously makes a simple derivative of any existing stock near-impossible!
 
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