Lothian Group discussion (Lothian City, Lothian Country Bus and East Coast Buses)

[ScotRail158725]

Im actually curious but do many people actually use the service past the Gyle to the Airport?

Yes

 

[computerSaysNo]

I hope Lothian will put more school journeys on the 400 when schools return because I use the 400 a lot in the weekday afternoon and right now they are delayed and always full by the time it gets to Sighthill.

I hope Lothian can fix this service in the afternoons because its always a riot.

To update this I got on the bus at 15:20 and its passing stops with people waiting because it is full.

There are/used to be two(?) afternoon short journeys on the 400 for the schools; are these not adequate? On a related note I've noticed the 400 takes a long time to load at stops because of the need to select and print tickets, is there any plan to improve this?

Also a general question: does the air conditioning on the 7900s work when the vehicle is on electric mode? Or only when the engine is on?

 

[TheEastCoaster]

I hope Lothian will put more school journeys on the 400 when schools return because I use the 400 a lot in the weekday afternoon and right now they are delayed and always full by the time it gets to Sighthill.

I hope Lothian can fix this service in the afternoons because its always a riot.

To update this I got on the bus at 15:20 and its passing stops with people waiting because it is full.

I've been saying this for a while; the 400 at the worst of times is standing room only and for a 30 minutes frequency route it's insufferable. The problem is you get the same argument that they can't increase the frequency because of lack of resources, which is a shame since I feel like the 400 could benefit with a 20 minute frequency.

 

[Darklord8899]

There are/used to be two(?) afternoon short journeys on the 400 for the schools; are these not adequate? On a related note I've noticed the 400 takes a long time to load at stops because of the need to select and print tickets, is there any plan to improve this?

Also a general question: does the air conditioning on the 7900s work when the vehicle is on electric mode? Or only when the engine is on?

I believe there is a 15:41 (Mon-Thur)/13:07 (Fri) schooldays journey from South Gyle access to Gillespie Crossroads but nothing timetabled the other way.

Given, of the top of my head, the 400 passes near Gracemount and Firrhill Schools (and possibly a school around Oxgangs as well (?)) Maybe a couple of Hyvot's Bank to Westside Plaza School shorts are needed?

Of course, easy to say, but, requires resources which may well not be feasible

 

[ScotRail158725]

Given, of the top of my head, the 400 passes near Gracemount and Firrhill Schools (and possibly a school around Oxgangs as well (?)) Maybe a couple of Hyvot's Bank to Westside Plaza School shorts are needed?

Of course, easy to say, but, requires resources which may well not be feasible

Bear in mind though Gracemounts catcchment area is almost all in Gracemount/Hyvots/Southouse within a 10-15 minute walk of the school. Whereas Forrester/St Augustines a lot of people there stay in Wester Hailes and that area which is a good trek away hence why theres an extra bus because theres a lot of people using it for a longer distance.

 

[CN04NRJ]

Also a general question: does the air conditioning on the 7900s work

Like almost every bus fitted with inadequate AC and no saloon opening windows for the UK market, not anymore.

 

[Darklord8899]

Bear in mind though Gracemounts catcchment area is almost all in Gracemount/Hyvots/Southouse within a 10-15 minute walk of the school. Whereas Forrester/St Augustines a lot of people there stay in Wester Hailes and that area which is a good trek away hence why theres an extra bus because theres a lot of people using it for a longer distance.

Ah thanks, yes, was "thinking out loud" from the comfort of my armchair!

 

[TheEastCoaster]

Bear in mind though Gracemounts catcchment area is almost all in Gracemount/Hyvots/Southouse within a 10-15 minute walk of the school. Whereas Forrester/St Augustines a lot of people there stay in Wester Hailes and that area which is a good trek away hence why theres an extra bus because theres a lot of people using it for a longer distance.

Saying that, there is also the 7/11 for that area also, so I can understand why the school runs would ideally be for Forrester-Wester Hailes, but saying that there is also the case of college and university students also at Sighthill, and any Firhill students that live beyond Fairmilehead.

Despite this I still think the 400 would be worth looking into more during the weekdays at least.

Also completely unrelated but does anyone know how popular the "N400" is?

 

[computerSaysNo]

Like almost every bus fitted with inadequate AC and no saloon opening windows for the UK market, not anymore.

I asked that question before and was told that the air conditioning does work most of the time, as quoted below.

Is the air con in 11-50 supposed to be functional?

Yes, and most of the times I've been on them, it's been cool inside.

 

[Bus9120UK]

I asked that question before and was told that the air conditioning does work most of the time, as quoted below.

In my personal experience as a daily user of these buses is that they generally do not work or blow heat, but in some instances I have found the bus to be colder than the outside.

 

[CN04NRJ]

I asked that question before and was told that the air conditioning does work most of the time, as quoted below.

Clearly enthusiasts know better!

 

[FlybeDash8Q400]

Not being a frequent user of the 7900’s it’s probably hard for me to pass a fair judgement, but from my few experiences and the general feeling across various different people I’ve spoken to about it, it rarely works. When it does work it works brilliantly, but a system can’t be called useful if it’s only great when it rarely works.

 

[danielhogg2005]

The new bus trackers that are being installed in the city centre, are all of them going to get replaced City wide?

And when will they start working?

 

[LothianBusesPh]

The new bus trackers that are being installed in the city centre, are all of them going to get replaced City wide?

And when will they start working?

What are they like? I've not seen them but some new ones have been installed in Musselburgh for "Bushub" stuff.

 

[diamond chap]

Looking likely it’s only a brief visit for publicity purposes in relation to the Labour Leader launching an energy event in Edinburgh today.

See tweet reference: https://twitter.com/andydphilip/status/1670707990029107200

Sounds like the bus failed and also got lost! So can assume it was just being housed at Central garage rather than being at Lothian specifically for demonstration.

That would explain why I saw it on Leith Walk on the back of a low loader:

 

[LothianBusesPh]

Someone sent me the new trackers, the old trackers have been fading out for a while anyway, all of the East Lothian ones were disabled earlier this year, as well as some places in Midlothian I believe. It just looks like a modernised version of the very outdated old trackers, hopefully, this can show more information on them too.

 

[Highland050261]

Who left that there?
(Image shows a Citylink double deck coach at Central depot)

 

[Bus9120UK]

Who left that there.

Scottish Citylink buses often use Central to layover.

 

[Blindtraveler]

Presumably a nice little earner for Lothian. Do they have access to any facilities such as driver welfare or basic maintenance, interior cleaning, bus wash, toilet drop etc as part of this

 

[JKP]

Who left that there.

I saw a West Coast Motors Citylink liveried coach leaving Central a few weeks ago so assume this is a regular occurrence.

 

[LothianBusesPh]

I saw a West Coast Motors Citylink liveried coach leaving Central a few weeks ago so assume this is a regular occurrence.

Yes, it is. Even that Mercedes Demonstrator they had was at Central.

 

[gavin1985]

Saying that, there is also the 7/11 for that area also, so I can understand why the school runs would ideally be for Forrester-Wester Hailes, but saying that there is also the case of college and university students also at Sighthill, and any Firhill students that live beyond Fairmilehead.

Despite this I still think the 400 would be worth looking into more during the weekdays at least.

Also completely unrelated but does anyone know how popular the "N400" is?

I for one will be getting the N400 for the first time a week on Friday for our flight to Malaga. Really grateful for the early service, however I am a bit surprised there are no other buses even leaving from the airport around midnight onward. Unless the plan is to expand on the service now it's classed as a Night service?

 

[BobScott]

Presumably a nice little earner for Lothian. Do they have access to any facilities such as driver welfare or basic maintenance, interior cleaning, bus wash, toilet drop etc as part of this

Any coach operator can use the facilities at Central through the main part of the day, for a small charge.

 

[gavin1985]

Not a chance. I think they’re simply being kept to stagger out the sales and specifically the money generated from them. I’d expect 841-850 and 926-936 to have all been sold before the end of the year. 195-198 I think are standby buses for any potential increase in single decks.

What’s more likely is that McGill’s don’t apply for the 20, 63 or 68 and Lothian picks up some of these. From what I understand there’s somewhat of an expectation from the council that Lothian will apply for them as well as the new Cramond to Gyle route, even the 68. Combined with the delivery of the BZL’s, should enough drivers be available it should allow for a potential conversion of the 30 to deckers, thus freeing up enough single decks whilst also withdrawing 1-10.

These contracts are all due to start/end in October, so we should get at least some idea of what the plan is with these by the end of the summer. I wouldn’t expect a concrete decision from the council until at least September though. I myself can see Lothian bidding for 3 of the 4 aforementioned routes. I can’t see them bidding for the 13 or the 68 though.

Just wondering, does anyone know how the 20 and 63 in particular are performing for McGill? Are they still at a reduced timetable of once an hour?

Even though the routes for these buses haven't changed. What are the chances of Lothian picking them up but perhaps making changes to the route to increase the catchment areas?
As I always found it odd how the 20 only started/finished at Chesser, could be worthwhile shifting it further along to like Dairy Road and making a "u-turn" at Torphichen Street. At least that way it gives another option for folk getting to Haymarket without going along Princess Street.
Would there be anyway of not having the 20 do the U-turn at Newbridge roundabout but instead going through Newbridge itself then around via the industrial estate and back on itself almost like the 63?

To me it would make more sense if Lothian did pick them up to bundle in with Lothian Country thanks to how the fare zones are set up.

 

[ScotRail158725]

Even though the routes for these buses haven't changed. What are the chances of Lothian picking them up but perhaps making changes to the route to increase the catchment areas?
As I always found it odd how the 20 only started/finished at Chesser, could be worthwhile shifting it further along to like Dairy Road and making a "u-turn" at Torphichen Street. At least that way it gives another option for folk getting to Haymarket without going along Princess Street.

It's a local route for the west of Edinburgh which is why it only goes to Chesser; there's no need nor demand to expand it east. Extending it to Haymarket - what's the point in that? At hourly it's more likely to be a drain on resources.

Would there be anyway of not having the 20 do the U-turn at Newbridge roundabout but instead going through Newbridge itself then around via the industrial estate and back on itself almost like the 63?

Going through Newbridge when it doesn’t need to, again would just be a drain on resources.

 

[Auld reekie]

Just wondering, does anyone know how the 20 and 63 in particular are performing for McGill? Are they still at a reduced timetable of once an hour?

Even though the routes for these buses haven't changed. What are the chances of Lothian picking them up but perhaps making changes to the route to increase the catchment areas?
As I always found it odd how the 20 only started/finished at Chesser, could be worthwhile shifting it further along to like Dairy Road and making a "u-turn" at Torphichen Street. At least that way it gives another option for folk getting to Haymarket without going along Princess Street.
Would there be anyway of not having the 20 do the U-turn at Newbridge roundabout but instead going through Newbridge itself then around via the industrial estate and back on itself almost like the 63?

To me it would make more sense if Lothian did pick them up to bundle in with Lothian Country thanks to how the fare zones are set up.

The 63 is still a 90 minute frequency.
Although I don’t use this service a lot, last week in the 9.25 from Balerno there were 10 passengers by the time the bus got to Heroit Watt University.
That is probably rare and not a true reflection on the service.

 

[FlybeDash8Q400]

With the new Gyle-Cramond service seemingly starting from Balerno this would suggest that the 63 will be curtailed, in my opinion to Hermiston Gait. I’ve been working out what I think is a slightly better idea for a while and I’ll post it in the speculative ideas thread in due course.

 

[roadierway77]

The 63 is still a 90 minute frequency.
Although I don’t use this service a lot, last week in the 9.25 from Balerno there were 10 passengers by the time the bus got to Heroit Watt University.
That is probably rare and not a true reflection on the service.

For such a low frequency, the 63 actually does quite well for passenger numbers in my experience. Morning services towards Balerno are quite busy between Queensferry and the Gyle, and even then I've seen buses throughout the day with around 10 passengers on board. For a subsidised service, it's quite well patronised in comparison to other council-supported routes I've used.

What the 63 really needs is a new timetable - its current one is unachievable and it's hopelessly unreliable, especially at peak times. I've stated this before but in the past I've had services run 30 minutes late. There's more than enough layover time at Balerno for this.

 

[neil henderson]

What are they like? I've not seen them but some new ones have been installed in Musselburgh for "Bushub" stuff.

The attached image shows one of the new tracker screens.

 

[Sussexscot]

It's a local route for the west of Edinburgh which is why it only goes to Chesser; there's no need nor demand to expand it east. Extending it to Haymarket - what's the point in that? At hourly it's more likely to be a drain on resources.

Going through Newbridge when it doesn’t need to, again would just be a drain on resources.

I have always thought that the 20 is two separate services and not really achieving either. The Gyle to Chesser is really a Shopper's bus but it just got extended to Ratho to service that growing "village". Why not keep the Gyle - Chesser as a Shopper's bus and have a new route (LCB?) Ratho to the city as an "X" service. Perhaps route past Forresters school then X27/28 stops from the Sighthill Roundabout. With Ratho getting bigger, it may even become a commercial service.