Vaccine Passports/Permanent restrictions

[Bikeman78]

To be fair cruises sound like miserable experiences at the best of times.

I've done one and I enjoyed it. It's quite a good way of spending a day in a few places. However, I would not go on another if I had to wear a mask every time I stepped out of my room. I've had a look at the website. 449 quid a person for a four day trip to Amsterdam seems a bit steep. I'd rather go on the Eurostar and have more time in Amsterdam.

 

[Gadget88]

This system has the potential to get very messy. As you say the "recently recovered" is vague, is it a set number of weeks after confirmed infection, antibody detection (which will vary from person to person) or something else again? Then there's the issue of the type of vaccine administered, if the EU is concerned about the effectiveness of one or more could they be excluded or require additional tests? And what about the medium / long term, will they require boosters, what sort of times would be accepted?

I could go on but you get the message. In the rush to be seen to be doing something, they could be storing up all sorts of issues. Meanwhile at least one country on the edge of the EU, with a similar climate to at least a couple of members & well placed to soak up new demand is lining up UK tourists without the need to vaccine passports or negative results. The EU wants to be careful, like the botched vaccination gesturing the EU might be causing more problems than it solves.

It will indeed get messy. If you never got a 3rd booster my guess is you would be forced to take a test. So even getting the vaccine doesn’t guarantee you a holiday you need them every six months maybe a year. For international travel a test maybe isn’t a big issue. But until we can so on the spot saliva testing at upload it on an app very widely easily accessible and cheap I can’t see how this will work. Testing has to be simple and cheap if you are going to test people regularly for covid. Personally I am surprised they don’t allow a small amount of community spread like flu given most people at risk have had this vaccine. I believe they will search for zero covid and shut down cities for a few cases if they can. Well scotland mentioned dropping down levels again..

 

[nlogax]

I've done one and I enjoyed it. It's quite a good way of spending a day in a few places. However, I would not go on another if I had to wear a mask every time I stepped out of my room. I've had a look at the website. 449 quid a person for a four day trip to Amsterdam seems a bit steep. I'd rather go on the Eurostar and have more time in Amsterdam.

Sorry, horses for courses I guess The idea of being stuck on a ship apart from a few onshore hours here and there make me twitchy. Re. Amsterdam, having used ES to get there for the first time a couple of years back I can't now imagine doing it any other way.

Anyway.. back to the topic. I can't see how this passport scheme would rely on full double doses considering how far behind most EU countries are with their deployment.

 

[Darandio]

Anyway.. back to the topic. I can't see how this passport scheme would rely on full double doses considering how far behind most EU countries are with their deployment.

Don't worry about that, it will only apply to non-mainland residents of the European continent, specifically ones from this island. Oh, and those who have been vaccinated with the AZ formula, no matter how many doses given they will stop at nothing to discredit it.

 

[XAM2175]

Covid: EU unveils 'digital green certificate' to allow citizens to travel

Plan will also allow states most reliant on tourism to make bilateral arrangements with non-EU members – including UK

www.theguardian.com

The European commission has unveiled a “digital green certificate” that could allow EU citizens who have been vaccinated, tested negative or recovered from Covid-19 to travel more freely within the bloc this summer. The plan would also allow southern states such as Spain, Greece and Portugal, whose economies are most reliant on tourism, to make bilateral arrangements with non-EU members – including Britain – providing the deals are approved by the commission.
...
Commission officials have been at at pains to stress it should be considered as a common framework to help national governments manage intra-bloc travel as vaccination programmes advance and restrictions gradually ease.
...
The plan stresses that it “cannot be a pre-condition to exercise free movement rights, nor can it be a pre-condition for using cross-border passenger transport services such as airlines, trains, coaches or ferries”.

The certificate should mean travellers will not need to quarantine, [and] would be available to all citizens who can provide evidence that they have either been vaccinated against Covid-19, have recently tested negative, or have acquired antibodies after recovering from the virus.
...
The commission’s plan, which it hopes will be approved by national governments and the European parliament by mid-June, says all vaccines approved by the EMA should be automatically recognised by member states. But governments will also be able to decide unilaterally whether they also want to authorise non EMA-approved shots, meaning countries that rely heavily on tourism will be able to allow travellers with Russian or Chinese [vaccinations] to enter if they choose.

EU Digital COVID Certificate

The Commission has instigated a programme of digital vaccine certificates to facilitate the re-opening of economic and social activity as well as travel

ec.europa.eu

And the Q&A sheet:

Press corner

Highlights, press releases and speeches

ec.europa.eu

The “Digital Green Certificate” will facilitate safe and free movement during the COVID-19 pandemic within the EU. A Digital Green Certificate will be a proof that a person has been vaccinated against COVID-19, has received a negative test result or has recovered from COVID-19 that can be used across all EU Member States. It can also be introduced in Iceland, Liechtenstein, Norway as well as Switzerland. The Digital Green Certificate will also be open to initiatives being developed globally.

1. General

What are the main elements of the proposal?

• The Digital Green Certificate system covers three different types of COVID-19 certificates: a vaccination certificate, a test certificate, and a certificate of recovery.
• They can be issued and used in all EU Member States to facilitate free movement. All EU citizens and their family members as well as non-EU nationals staying or residing in the Member States and who have the right to travel to other Member States, would be eligible to receive them free of charge.
• The certificates should only include a minimum set of information necessary to confirm and verify the holder's vaccination, testing or recovery status.
• Being vaccinated will not be a pre-condition to travel. All EU citizens have a fundamental right to free movement in the EU and this applies regardless of whether they are vaccinated or not. The same principle applies to the rights of non-EU nationals staying or residing in the EU Member States and who have the right to travel to other Member States. The Digital Green Certificate will make it easier to exercise that right, also through testing and recovery certificates.

...

 

[notlob.divad]

Don't worry about that, it will only apply to non-mainland residents of the European continent, specifically ones from this island. Oh, and those who have been vaccinated with the AZ formula, no matter how many doses given they will stop at nothing to discredit it.

No it won't, note the comment: "Commission officials have been at at pains to stress it should be considered as a common framework to help national governments manage intra-bloc travel as vaccination programmes advance and restrictions gradually ease."

Intra not inter. This is very much aimed at preventing restirctions on freedom of movement within the block, not for non-EU citizens coming in.

 

[DelayRepay]

P&O are now saying passengers must have proof of vaccination plus have insurance that will cover medical repatriation related to the virus. They will also be enforcing masks and distancing on board their ships on the round Britain cruises this summer - even though this appears to be after the government's planned date for ending restrictions:

P&O Cruises says travellers will need vaccinations

Customers will have to prove they have had two coronavirus jabs to get on the company's cruises.

www.bbc.co.uk

Does anyone else think they are on shaky ground legally with the vaccine requirement?

Given that vaccines are only available through the NHS, and that as a 40 year old I am not currently eligible for a vaccine, would this be discrimination on the grounds of age? Indirect discrimination, yes, but I am not sure it is lawful. I guess a court would have to decide whether the risk of allowing non-vaccinated people on the ship justifies this.

I have no desire to go on a ship anyway but it is concerning and I hope someone will challenge this through the courts.

 

[AlterEgo]

Does anyone else think they are on shaky ground legally with the vaccine requirement?

Given that vaccines are only available through the NHS, and that as a 40 year old I am not currently eligible for a vaccine, would this be discrimination on the grounds of age? Indirect discrimination, yes, but I am not sure it is lawful. I guess a court would have to decide whether the risk of allowing non-vaccinated people on the ship justifies this.

I have no desire to go on a ship anyway but it is concerning and I hope someone will challenge this through the courts.

It would be interesting to see a test case, that’s for sure.

 

[packermac]

It would be interesting to see a test case, that’s for sure.

Not sure you can have housing that is for the over 50's and I believe there may have been "no children" cruises in the past.
Not sure not be allowed on a cruise at 40 is different to not being eligible for an individual railcard at that age.
I think the more interesting issue is the chance of getting the letter they will want from your GP showing two vaccinations have been administered.

 

[kristiang85]

If you want to feed into the government's review on this, you can do so here: https://www.gov.uk/government/consu...status-certification-review-call-for-evidence

You have until Monday 29th March.

Though the fact that are doing it shows that when the vaccine minister said that were absolutely not going to go down this route was, a yet another, barefaced lie.

 

[Gadget88]

Turkey will allow you in unvaccinated or without a test this summer.

The bad news is Europe has a third wave now so chances of this government letting people go almost zero.

 

[Eyersey468]

If you want to feed into the government's review on this, you can do so here: https://www.gov.uk/government/consu...status-certification-review-call-for-evidence

You have until Monday 29th March.

Though the fact that are doing it shows that when the vaccine minister said that were absolutely not going to go down this route was, yet another, barefaced lie.

Is anyone really surprised that they have lied yet again l?

 

[Mintona]

No summer holidays for you this year...

Summer holidays abroad 'extremely unlikely' - BBC News

There is a risk travellers could bring Covid variants back to the UK, a government adviser warns.

www.bbc.com

Summer holidays overseas are "extremely unlikely" because of the risk of travellers bringing coronavirus variants back to the UK, a scientist on a government advisory body has said.

The UK faces a "real risk" if people travel abroad, Dr Mike Tildesley said.

Foreign holidays are currently not allowed and returning travellers have to quarantine.

Transport Secretary Grant Shapps said it was "too early to tell" when holidays abroad would be allowed.

Under the current roadmap for easing restrictions, the earliest date people in England could holiday abroad would be 17 May .

 

[Darandio]

No summer holidays for you this year...

I mean, that isn't what it says. Judging by your other posts on the matter and the fact that you seem to be revelling in the fact people are suggesting restrictions will continue, I suspect you would be over the moon if nobody could go abroad until 2022.

 

[Richard Scott]

No summer holidays for you this year...

Summer holidays abroad 'extremely unlikely' - BBC News

There is a risk travellers could bring Covid variants back to the UK, a government adviser warns.

www.bbc.com

Sorry they all need to get a grip. Fed up with this eternal pathetic attitude towards this virus. We have to get on with life and the media need to stop pushing this. They'll wonder why there's an increase in Mental Health issues soon. Well that'll be easy to explain, idiotic politicians and the media.

 

[Mintona]

I mean, that isn't what it says. Judging by your other posts on the matter and the fact that you seem to be revelling in the fact people are suggesting restrictions will continue, I suspect you would be over the moon if nobody could go abroad until 2022.

It’s pretty much exactly what it says.

The second bit isn’t true at all. The place I’ve missed more than anywhere over the last twelve months is the south galleries lounge at Terminal 5, full of anticipation of a trip to somewhere new. I’m just aware of how many times we’ve all been told it’ll be over soon, only not to be. I’m trying to keep people’s excitement in check so they hopefully aren’t as disappointed when it inevitably all goes wrong again.

 

[KeithMcC]

Sorry they all need to get a grip. Fed up with this eternal pathetic attitude towards this virus. We have to get on with life and the media need to stop pushing this. They'll wonder why there's an increase in Mental Health issues soon. Well that'll be easy to explain, idiotic politicians and the media.

+many!! Personally I am more interested in business travel as my job means I normally go abroad many times a year and COVID has lost me a lot of income as I am self employed - but not eligible for any support. That is not helping my mental health at all!

 

[NorthKent1989]

If you want to feed into the government's review on this, you can do so here: https://www.gov.uk/government/consu...status-certification-review-call-for-evidence

You have until Monday 29th March.

Though the fact that are doing it shows that when the vaccine minister said that were absolutely not going to go down this route was, a yet another, barefaced lie.

It’s disgraceful that authoritarianism is even being considered

 

[liam456]

If you want to feed into the government's review on this, you can do so here: https://www.gov.uk/government/consu...status-certification-review-call-for-evidence

You have until Monday 29th March.

Though the fact that are doing it shows that when the vaccine minister said that were absolutely not going to go down this route was, a yet another, barefaced lie.

Thanks for the heads up, I've sent a response along the lines of hell no!

 

[Baxenden Bank]

Thanks for the heads up, I've sent a response along the lines of hell no!

Having identified yourself to them, the thought police will be round later, giving you the opportunity to correct your opinions.

 

[Gadget88]

Qantas boss: Governments 'to insist' on vaccines for flying

"Governments are going to insist" on vaccines for international travellers, Qantas' boss tells the BBC.

www.bbc.co.uk

So families banned no under 18’s no pregnant women or people with allergies. How are airlines allowed to sprout this stuff when they know 100% vaccination is impossible? I fear it’s the scaremongering machine to get your jab get your holiday but saga already hinting now even with half vaccinated that holidays are not possible. Absolutely grim.

 

[kristiang85]

Qantas boss: Governments 'to insist' on vaccines for flying

"Governments are going to insist" on vaccines for international travellers, Qantas' boss tells the BBC.

www.bbc.co.uk

So families banned no under 18’s no pregnant women or people with allergies. How are airlines allowed to sprout this stuff when they know 100% vaccination is impossible? I fear it’s the scaremongering machine to get your jab get your holiday but saga already hinting now even with half vaccinated that holidays are not possible. Absolutely grim.

Travel will only be for the business elite on this airline then... (as presumably the lack of passengers will be made up for with exorbitant ticket costs)

 

[NorthKent1989]

My belief is that they will try and enforce vaccine passports in the U.K. but ultimately it will fail, the majority of us still hate authoritarianism of any kind

 

[kristiang85]

My belief is that they will try and enforce vaccine passports in the U.K. but ultimately it will fail, the majority of us still hate authoritarianism of any kind

Given how hard people went against Blair and his ID cards, I think that will be the final straw for many.

 

[NorthKent1989]

Given how hard people went against Blair and his ID cards, I think that will be the final straw for many.

Given how hard people went against Blair and his ID cards, I think that will be the final straw for many.

Agreed, I think some venues will want a negative test result, but other than that even if the government does succeed in passing it through most pubs and restaurants will ignore it, they’ll want as much custom as possible and won’t bite the hand that literally feeds them, and judging by the sheer number of those who went on yesterday’s March in London, it’ll definitely be a hard sell.

A friend of mine in Israel who hasn’t been vaccinated has told me that some venues are already being lax with the rules, first unvaccinated weren’t allowed in and just weeks later they are now allowed to sit in a “outdoor area” which is basically a tarpaulin tent attached to the indoor section of the restaurant and vaccinated people can sit amongst the unvaccinated if they so wish.

This means that venues care more about money than whether someone has had a vaccine or not, because either all, both have money and money has always spoken loudest.

So I think this will go down faster than a lead balloon

 

[AlterEgo]

Qantas boss: Governments 'to insist' on vaccines for flying

"Governments are going to insist" on vaccines for international travellers, Qantas' boss tells the BBC.

www.bbc.co.uk

So families banned no under 18’s no pregnant women or people with allergies. How are airlines allowed to sprout this stuff when they know 100% vaccination is impossible? I fear it’s the scaremongering machine to get your jab get your holiday but saga already hinting now even with half vaccinated that holidays are not possible. Absolutely grim.

Australia is deeply authoritarian. Today’s Australians are as much the children of jailers as they are convicts.

 

[XAM2175]

Australia is deeply authoritarian. Today’s Australians are as much the children of jailers as they are convicts.

Influenced quite a bit by the number of Brits who made enough of themselves to emigrate in more recent times.

 

[Gadget88]

So Saturday: we were told:

No foreign holidays this summer

Sunday:

Masks and social distancing will continue for YEARS

Today:

Campaign urges Britons to take two Covid tests a week

Testing drive will encourage adults to test themselves twice a week and will be supplemented by sewage monitoring to quickly identify cases across the UK.

www.dailymail.co.uk

You need to test yourself for the virus twice a week.

So it seems the vaccine isn’t the so called freedom pass it was being sold on. Funny that it’s come out after 55% have been vaccinated.

 

[bengley]

This changing of the goalposts needs to be stopped NOW. I can only see more protests and violence occurring if this continues. Our European neighbours have had their fair share already.

 

[nlogax]

So Saturday: we were told:

No foreign holidays this summer

Sunday:

Masks and social distancing will continue for YEARS

You read panic-inducing media articles designed to sell clicks, and you bought into them. Let's step back a bit and see what actually happens.