Avanti West Coast: Standard Premium

[185143]

Meanwhile I'm in First Class proper on LNER.

£20.95 (railcard), so £7 dearer than Standard, for an advance on the day from Edinburgh to Newcastle. Taking nearly 3.5 hours as it's diverted via Carlisle. I'm the only one in Coach M and I get the impression there's very few passengers on indeed. Had a couple of free beers, declined the food as I was eating at the time it was offered. Just had another offer of food and drink leaving Carlisle. Only one pass with the trolley since Edinburgh although the crew were more than happy to give me another beer when I asked for one near Carstairs.

 

[Merseysider]

Meanwhile I'm in First Class proper on LNER.

£20.95 (railcard), so £7 dearer than Standard, for an advance on the day from Edinburgh to Newcastle. Taking nearly 3.5 hours as it's diverted via Carlisle. I'm the only one in Coach M and I get the impression there's very few passengers on indeed. Had a couple of free beers, declined the food as I was eating at the time it was offered. Just had another offer of food and drink leaving Carlisle. Only one pass with the trolley since Edinburgh although the crew were more than happy to give me another beer when I asked for one near Carstairs.

Similar experience on the Chieftain KGX-INV today. Good frequent (friendly) service from all staff concerned, and I get the impression that they enjoy their job. Could rarely say the same when in 1st on Virgin/Avanti.

There will of course be those who disagree, but the level of service in 1st on LNER is ime head and shoulders above that VT/Avanti ever provide(d).

At least in Avanti Standard Premium you know you’ll get no food, as opposed to feeling lucky that the catering staff are gracing you with their presence once on a 1h25m trip up to Brum

 

[AlterEgo]

Mad idea, what if the introduction of Standard Premium was (at least in part) due to labour shortages for catering staff following brexit and covid?

Railway staff shortages because of Brexit? Not a chance of there ever being a shortage of staff for any reason on the railway. Every vacancy is massively oversubscribed.

 

[ScottGallagher]

A contentious opinion but for all the argument over catering standards, is it easier all round that aside from a trolley and taking into account the length of must journeys it's canned altogether across the board. How much outcry would there really be in the long run? People would get used to it just as they have on European flights in the last 20 years.

 

[185143]

Similar experience on the Chieftain KGX-INV today. Good frequent (friendly) service from all staff concerned, and I get the impression that they enjoy their job. Could rarely say the same when in 1st on Virgin/Avanti.

There will of course be those who disagree, but the level of service in 1st on LNER is ime head and shoulders above that VT/Avanti ever provide(d).

At least in Avanti Standard Premium you know you’ll get no food, as opposed to feeling lucky that the catering staff are gracing you with their presence once on a 1h25m trip up to Brum

To be fair, I did have a couple of *very* good trips with VT/Avanti pre-Covid. My last one in Feb 2020 was fantastic. Had a few too many (which is very, very unlike me ) between Glasgow and Preston and was actually a bit sad when the TM announced our arrival! Also on another trip had a member of staff ask me if I wanted two beers at Milton Keynes as he wouldn't get back to me before Euston. Needless to say I duly obliged!

 

[DanNCL]

I’m in standard premium now and I have to say I’m really impressed, not least because the first class host didn’t realise that the coach I’m in was standard premium and not first so has given everyone free refreshments.

I can tell that the staff I’ve encountered on this train enjoy their jobs, potentially some of the friendliest railway staff I’ve ever encountered. It’s a Scottish crew if that makes any difference.

 

[Carlisle]

Similar experience on the Chieftain KGX-INV today. Good frequent (friendly) service from all staff concerned, and I get the impression that they enjoy their job. Could rarely say the same when in 1st on Virgin/Avanti.

There will of course be those who disagree, but the level of service in 1st on LNER is ime head and shoulders above that VT/Avanti ever provide(d).

At least in Avanti Standard Premium you know you’ll get no food, as opposed to feeling lucky that the catering staff are gracing you with their presence once on a 1h25m trip up to Brum

To be fair, during these yearly ECML diversions a significant proportion of passengers who can, seem to prefer the faster, Avanti & predecessor’s services over the slower LNER or XC bus replacements, hence the recent postings from a near empty Azuma first class.

 

[185143]

I’m in standard premium now and I have to say I’m really impressed, not least because the first class host didn’t realise that the coach I’m in was standard premium and not first so has given everyone free refreshments.

I can tell that the staff I’ve encountered on this train enjoy their jobs, potentially some of the friendliest railway staff I’ve ever encountered. It’s a Scottish crew if that makes any difference.

The Scottish crews do seem to be more generous on Avanti by all accounts.

 

[LarryRailer]

More data points:
Travelled SP today (a Saturday) for the first time on pre-booked advance tickets (previously have just done the onboard upgrades).

I was assigned a seat in coach H (as expected) on BHM-WGN, but a seat in coach J (to my great surprise) for the WGN-BHM.

Once on board, both Coach Hs had the “Standard Premium” logo antimacassars, but Coach J seats had NO antimacassars (the normal “First Class” logo ones had all been removed).

It made coach J look a bit “cheap” (like it did during the first few weeks after AWC took over the franchise)…and could have led to some interesting discussions with staff had any standard ticket holders decided to sit in coach J. Sure, the doors and outsides of carriages still say First Class (too hard/expensive to vary?), but the counter-argument would be that Coach H doors/outsides also still say First Class, which is demonstrably never true these days.

AWC need to get their act together. Come back VT, all is forgiven

With apologies for replying to my own post…

I noticed on exiting the WGN-BHM train that seats 2 - 7 in Coach J (i.e. nearest Coach K) actually did have the “First Class” antimacassars (and two of the occupants, departed before me, had clearly been served first class refreshments earlier in the journey).

So, looks like Coach J (at least) will be mixed configuration (First and SP) depending on ticket demand for each trip.

 

[Scotrail314209]

I’m in standard premium now and I have to say I’m really impressed, not least because the first class host didn’t realise that the coach I’m in was standard premium and not first so has given everyone free refreshments.

I can tell that the staff I’ve encountered on this train enjoy their jobs, potentially some of the friendliest railway staff I’ve ever encountered. It’s a Scottish crew if that makes any difference.

Not surprised, I’ve never had a problem with the Scottish crew.

My only issue was doing a Euston to Birmingham with some very bored and surly hosts in first class. However, those ones were based in Wolverhampton.

 

[Butts]

Not surprised, I’ve never had a problem with the Scottish crew.

My only issue was doing a Euston to Birmingham with some very bored and surly hosts in first class. However, those ones were based in Wolverhampton.

Hopefully that has all changed now with the new "Bells and Whistles" Avanti 1st Class -1 Carriage to serve on a Sunday it should be a freebie bonanza !!

 

[Bald Rick]

Similar experience on the Chieftain KGX-INV today. Good frequent (friendly) service from all staff concerned, and I get the impression that they enjoy their job. Could rarely say the same when in 1st on Virgin/Avanti.

There will of course be those who disagree, but the level of service in 1st on LNER is ime head and shoulders above that VT/Avanti ever provide(d).

I must say I disagree. Every trip I have had in First with Avanti, and I mean every one of the dozens I have had, before and through Covid, has seen excellent staff and excellent service.

This on services to/from the West Midlands, Manchester, Scotland, Blackpool and Penrith.

 

[Emaharg]

Does that mean even if there is a run after 11am on a train originating before that time there is no Alcohol available ?

As a comparison in BA Club it is available even on the earliest flights.

From the evidence of the 1007 to Liverpool last Saturday yes. The steward was asked a few times.

 

[Butts]

From the evidence of the 1007 to Liverpool last Saturday yes. The steward was asked a few times.

Is it for sale in the Buffet at this time when not available to 1st Class Passengers as part of their package ?

 

[Merseysider]

From the evidence of the 1007 to Liverpool last Saturday yes.

That’s probably for the best, a train full of us scousers can be quite a racket once the booze is out

 

[Grumpy Git]

That’s probably for the best, a train full of us scousers can make more of a racket once the booze is out

FTFY.

 

[The Prisoner]

Posted earlier in the thread about the poor choice of Standard Prem or 1st from Chester at the moment due to the decimated N Wales/Chester directs.

Aimed to travel down on the 1035 on Monday changing at Crewe for the 1122 on to Euston. Got the 1122 by minutes at Crewe as the 1035 was 40 late (freight failed in front at Rhyl), but the delay to said 1035 manifested itself just as I'd "won" an auction for £35 for a Seatfrog upgrade to 1st on the 1122 at around 10am.

Had to get the 1055 TfW shuttle which was a crush loaded pair of 153s - it was carrying the 1035's load, and it turned out the 0954 TfW to Crewe had also been cancelled as well due to a points failure.

1st was well worth the £35 for the food, but more importantly the quiet as I had some work to do. Wi-fi seems better (actually could send a few attachments with no difficulty) and a plus one to other comments here for good service. In all the years of travelling up and down the WCML (live in Chester, parents in Penrith) the 1st service has been excellent and always found staff at both ends of the line keen to oblige with extra beers, or a "i'll leave you the bottle as I might not be back".

SP was empty-ish on the 1122, but 1st around 50% full.

Winning the Seatfrog thing put a first single to London at £101 (£66 standard single + £35 upgrade), which was cheaper (just) than a split Chester-Crewe standard, Crewe-London Standard Prem ticket which would have been around £104.

Observations - SP useless to Chester/N Wales as through ticketing not available (missing a trick?), Seatfrog decent (not used it before), staff and 1st class excellent as always, Avanti wants shooting for still not offering a decent number of direct Chester/N Wales services - that 1055 TfW 153 x 2 shuttle was very uncomfortable for the numbers (and ironically had big red 2m social distancing stickers everywhere!!!!)

 

[MKB]

Don't know if this is to be a regular thing from now on on match days, but the 10:16 Euston to Liverpool today has just Coach K for first class. Coaches G, H and J are all standard premium and about 80% full. Standard is also 80% full. (Last home game, there were still three first-class coaches on my trains.)

No wonder there were no first class Advance tickets or Seat Frog upgrades at any point for today's.

I haven't yet been on a 100% full match-day train this season, which is unprecedented. They are usually bursting. Anecdotal evidence from LFC fan sites is that, it's not just down to Covid: plenty who previously used the train still want to but have been priced off by Avanti.

 

[185143]

Don't know if this is to be a regular thing from now on on match days, but the 10:16 Euston to Liverpool today has just Coach K for first class. Coaches G, H and J are all standard premium and about 80% full. Standard is also 80% full. (Last home game, there were still three first-class coaches on my trains.)

No wonder there were no first class Advance tickets or Seat Frog upgrades at any point for today's.

I haven't yet been on a 100% full match-day train this season, which is unprecedented. They are usually bursting. Anecdotal evidence from LFC fan sites is that, it's not just down to Covid: plenty who previously used the train still want to but have been priced off by Avanti.

Apparently it's a regular thing at weekends now. Which has had the (almost certainly) unintended effect of excluding wheelchair users from travelling 1st class at weekends as the wheelchair space is in coach J...

 

[py_megapixel]

Apparently it's a regular thing at weekends now. Which has had the (almost certainly) unintended effect of excluding wheelchair users from travelling 1st class at weekends as the wheelchair space is in coach J...

Presumably if a wheelchair user turned up with a first class ticket they'd still have to provide them with the first class amenities (i.e. food and newspapers) even if they had to sit in an SP car?

 

[Starmill]

Presumably if a wheelchair user turned up with a first class ticket they'd still have to provide them with the first class amenities (i.e. food and newspapers) even if they had to sit in an SP car?

This is in general true on all trains, even those which don't have First Class wheelchair spaces and never have done. However, it has to be clear in advance of the ticket buying process whether the service is accessible or not.

 

[185143]

Presumably if a wheelchair user turned up with a first class ticket they'd still have to provide them with the first class amenities (i.e. food and newspapers) even if they had to sit in an SP car?

It wouldn't be overly difficult to do, the wheelchair space is just inside Coach J.

 

[station_road]

It's been mentioned several times that the first few seats in coach J (including those around the wheelchair space) are also marked as First Class at weekends

 

[p.d87]

It's been mentioned several times that the first few seats in coach J (including those around the wheelchair space) are also marked as First Class at weekends

Should be The first 6 seats nearest loo. Including the wheelchair bay.

 

[gordonthemoron]

Got the Avanti service from Milton Keynes to Manchester on 2/10, with reservation in Standard Premium, our seats were occupied already. No great problem as ther were other seats. It appears that the reservations had not been downloaded and the guard/conductor had sold upgrades. Surely they should not be doing this? They already know that the reservation system is not working

 

[Trackman]

I've noticed this on the last couple of trips that the reservations were not working. All it gave was the seat number.
So has it been busted for a while and I've never noticed?

If SP was totally rammed I wouldn't oust the person sat in my seat with nowhere to sit, I'd find the TM and see if it would be OK to sit in First.
It nearly happened to me the other week as SP was full (9 car) on the day I boarded. I bought an overpriced advance First the day before as I need to return urgently home and there were no SP advances available. It's a good job I didn't take the Standard-SP gamble which I was contemplating, the reason being there were only standard walk-ups available and I couldn't chance it being full at the origin. I reckon if I had SP advance on that the train, it was so rammed someone would have been sat in my seat.

 

[Mcr Warrior]

Effectively selling the same seat twice? Really?!

 

[Bletchleyite]

Effectively selling the same seat twice? Really?!

Not really, because if the service paid for wasn't delivered you would presumably be entitled to a refund of the difference, as per First Class.

 

[philthetube]

Particularly in the railway industry, where you can find a shocking amount of arrogance towards customers. Many of the things I hear guards, RPIs and even catering team say to customers on a regular basis would never be tolerated in most other workplaces.

Sadly, this does de-value first class. Particularly with LNER these days, but also on Avanti, the service is a case of - here you are, you can have a small bit of food and drink I guess - don’t you dare ask for anything extra during your four hour journey though, or we’ll embarrass you with a schoolteacher comment on being greedy or “you’ve had enough” (Yes, I’ve seen an LNER host say to a woman “I think you’ve had enough” after receiving two drinks and one sandwich on a trip from Leeds to London)

Standard premium, first class, whatever. Attitude is everything and neither will be satisfactory without the basic customer service that seems so hard to find these days.

This may have been a correct thing to do by the host, if we are talking alcohol.

 

[185143]

This may have been a correct thing to do by the host, if we are talking alcohol.

It may well have been, but that seems unlikely after two drinks.