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First West Yorkshire & York discussion

noddingdonkey

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Huddersfield seem to have acquired some 09 plate Gemini cast offs from Leeds. Some have already been repainted into HD Connect livery.

Sadly nothing has been done about the interiors and the filthy seat coverings.

I assume these are to see off the last of the ALX400s?
 
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Seehof

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Any changes planned for First York? We still have some Uni liveried buses running about on the 1,4 & 5s. Their paintwork is shabby and, of course, entirely inappropriate. One double deck EV seems to be on the 4s every day and the Hospital bus often escapes on to other routes. The original fleet of single deck EVs for P&R route 59 seems to have totally disappeared as has route 59. It always amuses me that a new large property development on the line of route seem to think that the 59 will restart soon but I understand it will not as First York do not have the staff.
On a positive note the service reduction to every 15 minutes on my local route 1 has led to remarkable reliability.
 

TheGrandWazoo

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Any changes planned for First York? We still have some Uni liveried buses running about on the 1,4 & 5s. Their paintwork is shabby and, of course, entirely inappropriate. One double deck EV seems to be on the 4s every day and the Hospital bus often escapes on to other routes. The original fleet of single deck EVs for P&R route 59 seems to have totally disappeared as has route 59. It always amuses me that a new large property development on the line of route seem to think that the 59 will restart soon but I understand it will not as First York do not have the staff.
On a positive note the service reduction to every 15 minutes on my local route 1 has led to remarkable reliability.
Wasn't there mention of the Uni services being retendered

Also, it was announced only earlier this year that there would be another tranche of electric vehicles but it's far too early to expect them to have arrived yet https://www.yorkpress.co.uk/news/20023408.york-gets-8-4-million-buy-44-new-electric-buses/

YORK council has been awarded more than £8.4 million to buy 44 new electric buses.

The government funding, confirmed by the Department for Transport today, will be matched by a further £10 million investment by First.

The new buses will be used on First’s routes 1, 4, 5 and 6, for the York Hospital shuttle bus and on Park&Ride route 2.
As for the Optare EVs, weren't they taken to storage in Halifax (?) as the batteries are knackered?
 

Seehof

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Thank you. Ah yes the 44 new electric buses which were due to come from Arrival. That is not going to happen and I imagine any replacements for these will take a couple of years to appear. Especially, as it was part of a deal First Bus corporate did with Arrival.
Bendy bus (11104) on the normally double deck P&R 3 today!
 

90sWereBetter

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Lost somewhere within Bank-Monument tube station,
Huddersfield seem to have acquired some 09 plate Gemini cast offs from Leeds. Some have already been repainted into HD Connect livery.

Sadly nothing has been done about the interiors and the filthy seat coverings.

I assume these are to see off the last of the ALX400s?

According to FirstBus Enthusiasts on Facebook, both Halifax and Huddersfield are taking large numbers of 09-plate B9s from Leeds/Bradford to replace most of the 04/54/05 plate B7TL/Geminis as well as the last few ALX400s.

The 06-plate B7s should be staying for the medium term at least.
 

Tempest3K

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As for the Optare EVs, weren't they taken to storage in Halifax (?) as the batteries are knackered?
That doesn't bode well for the usual First York method of sweating everything for 18+ years when it comes to the Optare DD fleet......
 

Harvey10

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Wondering what changes First York are planning in October? Rumors are 11 being cut back to South Bank and numerous network changes
 

Seehof

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The possible changes to 11 have been in the local press. The only rumour I have heard is that First York has no intention of operating route 59 should it reappear. Any other possibilities/rumours?
 
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(As a precursor to all & so another message doesn't get deleted for "no source", my source(s) is/are I know people inside, I am not allowed to say more than this)
Any changes planned for First York? We still have some Uni liveried buses running about on the 1,4 & 5s. Their paintwork is shabby and, of course, entirely inappropriate. One double deck EV seems to be on the 4s every day and the Hospital bus often escapes on to other routes. The original fleet of single deck EVs for P&R route 59 seems to have totally disappeared as has route 59. It always amuses me that a new large property development on the line of route seem to think that the 59 will restart soon but I understand it will not as First York do not have the staff.
On a positive note the service reduction to every 15 minutes on my local route 1 has led to remarkable reliability.

I know what the plan is with 59s, but I'm not sure I'm allowed to say. If you can do a little abstracting from the below, you may be able to work it out ;)
One of the Versa EVs has been away since Feb getting a new drivetrain and batteries, all will be retrofitted and reintroduced if it goes well. (If not, it may be some more robbing of buses from other W Yorks depots?) Some of them were/are (IDK if any are still there) indeed stored in Halifax as the batteries were KO'd on some. You just need to note that often the UB1 has a streetlite or a B7RLE on in the afternoon.

One 4 is regularly scheduled to be a DD EV as they have 4/5 Metrodeckers in non P&R livery, which were to boost city services, not for P&R as the 9 was supposed to stay single deck EV along with the 59.
The HSB interworks with a 6, so it's no longer guaranteed to be the dedicated branded bus. No clue what is to happen to the uni liveried B9s, whether they will be repainted into a standard first livery or not, but university services are getting new streetdeck micro hybrids as a filler until the uni services are re-tendered. Whoever wins, it's to go electric.

Bendy buses are to be the first buses to go once new EVs arrive. Was supposed to be the arrival buses but as others have pointed out, no longer happening. Not heard anything concrete on what the replacement is, but I know yutongs were thought of very highly among drivers who tested one a few years ago.
Thank you. Ah yes the 44 new electric buses which were due to come from Arrival. That is not going to happen and I imagine any replacements for these will take a couple of years to appear. Especially, as it was part of a deal First Bus corporate did with Arrival.
Bendy bus (11104) on the normally double deck P&R 3 today!

Bendy buses are to be allocated as 3 on the 2s, then 1 on 8s (Board Starting 0724/0924/0954, M-F/Sa/Su) then either another 1 on 8s (Board starting 0500/0930, M-Sa/Su), 1 on 3s or 1 on 7s, in that preference order. Not all drivers are bendy trained, so occasionally this doesn't always hold true and I know of one driver who took a bendy on a 10. I know the 8 boards they go on as I frequently use the 8s, unsure on the 3/7 boards are I don't really use them often
 
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A mix of single decks and double decks (much like the current fleet, really).
24 Kites to replace 12 Versas, 5 bendys and some B7s I’m presuming.

20 Electroliners combined with the 12 hybrids already ordered would see off the worst of the B9 deckers, and some of them are in a right state.

If they kept the 12 Versas, the extra Kites could be used to see off all the B9 double deckers.
 

TheGrandWazoo

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24 Kites to replace 12 Versas, 5 bendys and some B7s I’m presuming.

20 Electroliners combined with the 12 hybrids already ordered would see off the worst of the B9 deckers, and some of them are in a right state.

If they kept the 12 Versas, the extra Kites could be used to see off all the B9 double deckers.
Wasn't there some talk that the single deckers would replace some doubles on routes at a higher frequency (though how that would work with a driver shortage, I'm not certain)?

The Versas will probably need repowering or new batteries; more likely, I suspect, is that they will be stored until such time that the depreciation is run down on them!
 

Seehof

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I don’t think First would ever want to increase frequencies. Since they made my local route (1) every 15 minutes, the service has become very reliable.
How are the costs regarding charging going to change in the future for First York? They are soon to have a very large EV fleet.
 
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Wasn't there some talk that the single deckers would replace some doubles on routes at a higher frequency (though how that would work with a driver shortage, I'm not certain)?

The Versas will probably need repowering or new batteries; more likely, I suspect, is that they will be stored until such time that the depreciation is run down on them!
See my earlier message:
One of the Versa EVs has been away since Feb getting a new drivetrain and batteries, all will be retrofitted and reintroduced if it goes well.


They are getting rid of the expensive to run Citaros.
Again:
Bendy buses are to be the first buses to go once new EVs arrive.
 

TheGrandWazoo

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See my earlier message:




Again:
Not certain what you're doing with the quotes function but I didn't mention bendis!

I did miss your post about new drivetrains for the Versas. Bit surprised given they're 8 years old - took long enough to repower Bath's e400Hs and they were much more standard kit and a longer projected life.
 
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Not certain what you're doing with the quotes function but I didn't mention bendis!

I did miss your post about new drivetrains for the Versas. Bit surprised given they're 8 years old - took long enough to repower Bath's e400Hs and they were much more standard kit and a longer projected life.
It screwed up and changed my name to yours on the quotes!

The versas were early pure battery and are shot as anything
 

TUC

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It is striking how much of this thread is concerned with vehicles rather than the services being provided. It is the latter which is the point of buses for most people,
 

TheGrandWazoo

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It screwed up and changed my name to yours on the quotes!

The versas were early pure battery and are shot as anything
No worries - I thought something was up.
It is striking how much of this thread is concerned with vehicles rather than the services being provided. It is the latter which is the point of buses for most people,
There are many threads where much discourse is had about the regulatory framework of bus services, quality (or not), pricing etc. This one just seems to have a focus on the prospective new vehicles and the fact that Huddersfield and Halifax have tended to get cascades.
 

noddingdonkey

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I think most of their regular passengers are resigned to the fact that the service will always be a shoestring bare minimum effort designed for those who don't have another option rather than a quality service designed to be an alternative to private cars.

There's no innovation to talk of, other than the half arsed introduction of TOTO that just caused more confusion and an app that lies about a countdown to the scheduled time being live data if the bus is cancelled.
 

TUC

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No worries - I thought something was up.

There are many threads where much discourse is had about the regulatory framework of bus services, quality (or not), pricing etc. This one just seems to have a focus on the prospective new vehicles and the fact that Huddersfield and Halifax have tended to get cascades.
I didn't mean the regulatory framework (as much as I find that interesting). I mean that what interests most people in terms of their bus services are changes in routes, new services etc., not what type of vehicle is operating them.

(The Quotes function is still doing strange things.)
 
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Ken H

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No worries - I thought something was up.

There are many threads where much discourse is had about the regulatory framework of bus services, quality (or not), pricing etc. This one just seems to have a focus on the prospective new vehicles and the fact that Huddersfield and Halifax have tended to get cascades.
Well First Leeds will have spare vehicles and drivers after the beginning of October when they pass the X98/X99 Leeds -Wetherby routes over to Transdev Coastliner.
 

TheGrandWazoo

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I didn't mean the regutory framework (as much as I find that interesting). I mean that what interests most people in terms of their bus services are changes in routes, new services etc., not what type of vehicle is operating them.

(The Quotes function is still doing strange things.)
I think the same statement applies. There are many threads (see First West of England) where service patterns and withdrawals are being extensively discussed, and there's a specific thread about Covid funding-related withdrawals. Perhaps West Yorkshire is a little less exciting at the moment, and that the X98/X99 withdrawal is being discussed on the Transdev thread.
 

Andyh82

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I didn't mean the regulatory framework (as much as I find that interesting). I mean that what interests most people in terms of their bus services are changes in routes, new services etc., not what type of vehicle is operating them.

(The Quotes function is still doing strange things.)
In West Yorkshire there very rarely are changes in routes or new services, the commercial network First run is little different to what it was 15 years ago

The only recent changes have been with the frequencies where pretty much every service has dropped down a frequency band compared to pre-COVID, the main services tend to be every 12/15/20 now rather than every 10
 

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